Author Topic: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?  (Read 4806 times)

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Dave V

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Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« on: February 03, 2013, 10:36:34 AM »
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Team,

My K4s threw a traction tire...  I guess it's more correct to say the tire disintegrated.  It's my fault, of course.  Paul Dolkos suggested that if my K4 is to appear in GMR 2014 (the photo shoot is in 2 weeks), I needed to tone down the shiny valve gear.  After hearing great things about Neolube, I bought some from Micro Mark, and it really is a neat product!

If you're not familiar, Neolube is essentially graphite powder in an alcohol suspension.  You can apply it to any surface, but it does seem to stick well to the plated wheel rims and valve gear of steam locomotives.  I've since used it to replicate graphite paint on smoke boxes of steam locomotives.  It looks awesome on the wheels, rods, and valve gear of my K4.  Once the alcohol evaporates, it leaves a dark gray graphite coating that also lubricates.

Well, I'm guessing my traction tires are pretty old...  The loco had been around a while when I bought it almost 10 years ago, and the rubber connections inside the engine were found to have decayed in 2009/2010 when Lee Weldon and Victor Miranda brought her back to life.  So it's no stretch of the imagination to expect that a little Neolube got on the traction tire and the evaporating alcohol took with it the last bit of structural integrity the tire had.  It fell off in pieces.

Now I have a deep groove on one side of the center driver.  The loco still runs, but she suffers a significant decrease in tractive effort and adhesion (although she has even less wobble now, LOL).  I do not relish the prospect of completely disassembling an otherwise functioning DCC brass locomotive (particularly the valve gear...  OMG).  She's gone from being a stump-puller to struggling with the very varnish she is meant to pull.   

What are my options?  I do have Bullfrog Snot.  It crossed my mind to attempt to fill the groove with it, but I'm nervous that it's too thick a requirement for it.  That said, absent any other viable options, that's my way-ahead.
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DKS

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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2013, 10:42:41 AM »
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I'd try the snot option. Apply a layer, let it dry, repeat until the groove is filled. If it fails, you should be able to remove it without too much grief.
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up1950s

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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2013, 11:01:44 AM »
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Maybe the Kato GS4 or some other TT would work .

Dave V

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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2013, 11:05:28 AM »
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Maybe the Kato GS4 or some other TT would work .

Possibly... But getting it on without completely disassembling the valve gear is probably a bridge too far.
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Lemosteam

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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2013, 11:08:04 AM »
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Dave, which driver is it?  you may only need to pull one pin/screw and it might be just enough to slip a tire under and put the pin/screw back.  Then try to fit the tire on after with a dental pick.

Dave V

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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2013, 11:12:23 AM »
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Dave, which driver is it?  you may only need to pull one pin/screw and it might be just enough to slip a tire under and put the pin/screw back.  Then try to fit the tire on after with a dental pick.

Center...  Per this pic pre-Neolube.



That's where the valve gear connects along with the drive rod and side rod.
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C855B

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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2013, 11:18:47 AM »
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Dave, which driver is it?  you may only need to pull one pin/screw and it might be just enough to slip a tire under and put the pin/screw back.  Then try to fit the tire on after with a dental pick.

I thought the same thing, until going to Spookshow's site and checking his closeup of the running gear, and mention that the TT was on the center driver. This is not going to be fun. I'm somewhat skeptical that layers of Bullfrog Snot can be applied evenly enough so that you don't end up with a decided limp.
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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2013, 11:24:57 AM »
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Yikes.  Looks like a "Miranda Project" to me.  Once the BFS is in there you might be able to true it up enough for the show and then get it repaired afterwards.

up1950s

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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2013, 11:30:03 AM »
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Snot is worth a shot . It can be removed , no disassembly required either putting on , or off . Repeatable as needed .

Maybe before doing that you can anchor the loco or train and take some spinning driver / valve gear blur shots with stationary scenery .

Dave V

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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2013, 11:46:19 AM »
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First coat of snot is on.  The short working time with the snot makes it a challenge, and I've already had to peel off a few layers.  That said, I have more snot than I will ever need, so it's not a big deal.

I just really want the groove filled in first.  Then I can worry about contouring the wheel.  I know I'll need at least one more coat to smooth it out.
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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2013, 11:48:38 AM »
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...  That said, I have more snot than I will ever need ...

Been dealing with a cold since Thursday, so I know the feeling.  :trollface: :facepalm:
...mike

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pjm20

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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2013, 12:36:36 PM »
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Team,

My K4s threw a traction tire...  I guess it's more correct to say the tire disintegrated.  It's my fault, of course.  Paul Dolkos suggested that if my K4 is to appear in GMR 2014 (the photo shoot is in 2 weeks), I needed to tone down the shiny valve gear.  After hearing great things about Neolube, I bought some from Micro Mark, and it really is a neat product!

If you're not familiar, Neolube is essentially graphite powder in an alcohol suspension.  You can apply it to any surface, but it does seem to stick well to the plated wheel rims and valve gear of steam locomotives.  I've since used it to replicate graphite paint on smoke boxes of steam locomotives.  It looks awesome on the wheels, rods, and valve gear of my K4.  Once the alcohol evaporates, it leaves a dark gray graphite coating that also lubricates.

Well, I'm guessing my traction tires are pretty old...  The loco had been around a while when I bought it almost 10 years ago, and the rubber connections inside the engine were found to have decayed in 2009/2010 when Lee Weldon and Victor Miranda brought her back to life.  So it's no stretch of the imagination to expect that a little Neolube got on the traction tire and the evaporating alcohol took with it the last bit of structural integrity the tire had.  It fell off in pieces.

Now I have a deep groove on one side of the center driver.  The loco still runs, but she suffers a significant decrease in tractive effort and adhesion (although she has even less wobble now, LOL).  I do not relish the prospect of completely disassembling an otherwise functioning DCC brass locomotive (particularly the valve gear...  OMG).  She's gone from being a stump-puller to struggling with the very varnish she is meant to pull.   

What are my options?  I do have Bullfrog Snot.  It crossed my mind to attempt to fill the groove with it, but I'm nervous that it's too thick a requirement for it.  That said, absent any other viable options, that's my way-ahead.

I have a bag of parts for this K4 that includes 2 Traction Tires. PM me if you are interested.
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Dave V

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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2013, 02:00:58 PM »
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Okay, so the first coat of snot failed...  I applied it to thick and too slow, so it looked very uneven and lumpy.  It all comes off in a stringy, snotty clump.  The second time, though, I applied it in a few rapid-succession coats with a pointy toothpick with almost no pressure with the drivers turning at high speed.  It now looks much, much more even.

The challenge with the snot is that it shrinks as it dries, so it exacerbates any unevenness.  I will let this coat fully cure before testing and assessing, but it looks much more promising this go around.

Oh, pjm20, I forgot to ask in my PM...  Your bag o'parts for the K4 is for a Precision Scale K4 and not a Key or other brand, right?  PSC seems to have cranked out quite a fleet of these.

Oh, and joy of joys...  I was able to remove that crappy crooked factory lettering without damaging the paint!  I'll not only apply proper 1950's buff lettering, but give her a proper K4 number.  5033 was an M1, not a K4.  She'll get an Alkem Scale Models etched brass keystone number plate.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2013, 02:02:52 PM by Dave Vollmer »
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bill pearce

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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #13 on: February 03, 2013, 02:18:11 PM »
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Actually, for a photo shoot for GMR, you don't need to get the tire replaced, just don't shoot that side of the loco if it is obvious. Y'o'u might need a helper to get the train around the layout, but the 0-5-0 might be enough. Don't obsess.

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Re: Brass loco throws traction tire... Thoughts?
« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2013, 02:47:20 PM »
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The parts or for the PSC K4. Isn't the PSC K4 the only brass K4?
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