ScaleTrains GP30 Arrival (End of January)

[nickelplate759]

But happier!

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

As will I.

[wmcbride]

I finally was able to open my GP30 today.

As others have mentioned, these are light but, wow, it is a really striking engine -- well-assembled and decorated!

[robertjohndavis]

Anyone have additional thoughts on running characteristics and sound quality? - Rob

[robert3985]

Anyone have additional thoughts on running characteristics and sound quality? - Rob

Since I don't have a Scaletrains GP30 (and won't be buying any since they're unfortunately anachronistic for my layout's era), I can't comment about their running characteristics.  However, since they have ESU Loksound Nano sound decoders, their electrical running qualities and their sound quality should be top-shelf. 

Although my opinion is that Soundtraxx Tsunamis have the very best steam sound, my experience is that ESU Loksound decoders have the very best diesel sound.

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

[lock4244]

My silent pair of DRGW arrived yesterday. They must've been quite violently handled by the USPS because both were dislodged from the cradle they ship in and one truck on one unit was popped out a little on arrival. First run there was a bit of grinding coming from them when negotiating curves (12x4 loop for now), however this died down in short order. I had the pair pulling a 31 car train and they handled it with a little slipping, but imo they outpull the Atlas GP40-2W based on that 31 car train. Keeping in mind this is essentially a flat loop, though there's some slight height deviation involved. They would not be able to handle that train on a 1% grade I'd imagine.

And yes... no need for DRGW GP30's. But they go nicely with my trio of DRGW SD40T-2's is also don't need for southern Ontario.

I sure hope they do CP GP30's at some point... be nice to have ST locomotives that actually make sense for my locale and era.

[wmcbride]

Anyone have additional thoughts on running characteristics and sound quality? - Rob

Mine are non-sound units but can report that Scale Trains continues to put big holes in the bottom of the fuel tank to "let the sound out."

I will eventually but Loksound in mine but will make sure I have a properly enclosed speaker to take advantage of the Loksound's capabilities and avoid "tinny" sound.

[peteski]

However, since they have ESU Loksound Nano sound decoders, their electrical running qualities and their sound quality should be top-shelf. 

Not quite that straightforward Bob.  The speaker system (speaker and enclosure) design has a lot to do with overall sound quality.

Just like if you feed audio output from some very expensive esoteric HiFi system to a small free-standinig speaker like it used to be used in those old transistor radios, it will sound like crap.  If a top notch DCC sound decoder drives a low quality speaker with improperly designed enclosure, it too will sound like crap.

[nickelplate759]

Not quite that straightforward Bob.  The speaker system (speaker and enclosure) design has a lot to do with overall sound quality.

Just like if you feed audio output from some very expensive esoteric HiFi system to a small free-standinig speaker like it used to be used in those old transistor radios, it will sound like crap.  If a top notch DCC sound decoder drives a low quality speaker with improperly designed enclosure, it too will sound like crap.

When I was a kid, I took the speakers from a couple of old hand-held transistor radios (about 2" diameter), and mounted them (in parallel) in an empty Athearn cardboard kit box, then connected that to some kind of electronic train-horn generator I bought somewhere.

I was quite pleased with my self.
It sounded like crap.

[robert3985]

Not quite that straightforward Bob.  The speaker system (speaker and enclosure) design has a lot to do with overall sound quality.

Just like if you feed audio output from some very expensive esoteric HiFi system to a small free-standinig speaker like it used to be used in those old transistor radios, it will sound like crap.  If a top notch DCC sound decoder drives a low quality speaker with improperly designed enclosure, it too will sound like crap.

@peteski - Well, Peter, you are entirely correct.  My assumption is that a company such as Scaletrains would naturally do the simple necessity of enclosing the speaker in an air-tight enclosure.

But, I could be wrong.

However, that doesn't change anything about ESU Loksound decoders being the very best diesel locomotive sound decoders, and hooking them up to a low quality non-enclosed speaker would be a crime.

In my experience, the sound that comes from a non-enclosed "floating" speaker is not "tinny"...but very quiet since many of the emitted sound waves generated by either side of the speaker diaphragm, being just the opposite of each other, cancel each other out...making the speaker very quiet, even when the volume is turned up to the max.

As small speakers continue to improve with broader frequency response, it's my hope that eventually the lower frequencies will be able to be reproduced in N-scale in the not-so-distant future.

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

[robertjohndavis]

My silent pair of DRGW arrived yesterday. They must've been quite violently handled by the USPS...

Thank you for the first hand account. 31 cars is better than I expected for a pair of them.

Rob

[GM50 4164]

Yes, next on the list. I have some 1/32" and 1/16" lead sheet on the way to try a couple of things. If you didn't catch it from a few months back, I tried tungsten powder in the fuel tank of an ST SD40-2, and what the powder makes up in relative convenience it loses in loss of density. Accomplished little.

'
Thanks for the photo Mike. I used some 3/64" lead sheet and slid a piece in between the motherboard and frame. I cut a notch into it to allow for the motor and speaker wires. I also added multiple pieces stacked on one another in the fuel tank in front of the speaker, for sound units and in the speaker chamber itself, for non sound units, on my SD40-2's There is also room for a TCS KA-N1 keep alive placed in the nose of the SD40-2 if you tape it to the nose with doublesided tape. This is for a low nose SD40-2 mind you. With your GP30's, the B version, you have quite a bit more room. For the low nose versions, the keep alive should fit the same as it did in my SD40-2's. From the factory, the SD40-2's with sound weight about 2.89oz. I was able to get the sound units up to 3.32oz and the non sound units up to 3.5oz. Greatly improves tractive effort and pickup!

[peteski]

@peteski - Well, Peter, you are entirely correct.  My assumption is that a company such as Scaletrains would naturally do the simple necessity of enclosing the speaker in an air-tight enclosure.

But, I could be wrong.

However, that doesn't change anything about ESU Loksound decoders being the very best diesel locomotive sound decoders, and hooking them up to a low quality non-enclosed speaker would be a crime.

Unfortunately speaker enclosure design  seems to be hit and miss with different manufacturers and even between different models from the same manufacturers.

I also agree that ESU sound decoders are some of the best  out there.

In my experience, the sound that comes from a non-enclosed "floating" speaker is not "tinny"...but very quiet since many of the emitted sound waves generated by either side of the speaker diaphragm, being just the opposite of each other, cancel each other out...making the speaker very quiet, even when the volume is turned up to the max.

While I'm not an audio engineer, to me your explanation is an oversimplification.  Not only the sound from a floating speaker appears not  as loud, because as you mentioned the air movement from the front and back of the cone or diaphragm cancel each other out, but due to the speed of sound waves in the air, there is a more complex interaction action than just cancellation. Depending on the specific frequency (wavelength) some frequencies could actually be amplified, while others cancelled almost totally.

[OldEastRR]

You guys talk about using tungsten weights. What size do you use, where can you get it, and what does it cost? looking on the 'net is confusing.

[samusi01]

Fuel tank cavity measurements: approximately 0.65" long, 0.44" wide, 0.18" tall.

For those with the DCC ready DRGW units and using a 59925 Lokpilot: Aux 6 controls the number boards - either all on or off, no front/rear control - and Aux 7 controls the mars light in the nose.

[C855B]

Fuel tank cavity measurements: approximately 0.65" long, 0.44" wide, 0.18" tall.

That matches what I measured this afternoon. Doing the calcs, solid lead in that space would yield 0.334 oz., or a ~15% increase in total weight. Worth the effort alone. Add to that Benjamin's strip of lead underneath the circuit board and my current thought of... hopefully... a 1/16" strip of lead glued to the underside of the body roof, and we might get a 40% improvement. I hope to know more later tomorrow.

We could nearly double this by using platinum. Or depleted uranium. You first.