Life-Like C-424s and Atlas C55 Turnouts

[BCR 570]

Hi

I have been trying to solve an issue with my ALCO C-425s and Atlas Code 55 turnouts.  They run on the Life-Like / Hobbycraft Canada ALCO C-424 chassis and they have had the wheels gauged as exact as possible.  I will now have to turn my attention to the turnouts and see if some of them have gauge issues.

The engines get stuck in many but not all of the turnouts, usually as the first wheel gets to the frog.  If I push the engines through I can feel them getting grabbed (serious friction).  On some turnouts they sail through with no issues.

This is not an issue for my Atlas/China RS-3s or C-420, which makes me wonder if it is something other than wheel gauge with these engines - maybe individual flange width or wheel tread profile?

Wondering if anyone else has had an issue with these particular locomotives and Atlas turnouts, and if so what the fix was.


Tim

[Bill H]

Hi

I have been trying to solve an issue with my ALCO C-425s and Atlas Code 55 turnouts.  They run on the Life-Like / Hobbycraft Canada ALCO C-424 chassis and they have had the wheels gauged as exact as possible.  I will now have to turn my attention to the turnouts and see if some of them have gauge issues.

The engines get stuck in many but not all of the turnouts, usually as the first wheel gets to the frog.  If I push the engines through I can feel them getting grabbed (serious friction).  On some turnouts they sail through with no issues.

This is not an issue for my Atlas/China RS-3s or C-420, which makes me wonder if it is something other than wheel gauge with these engines - maybe individual flange width or wheel tread profile?

Wondering if anyone else has had an issue with these particular locomotives and Atlas turnouts, and if so what the fix was.


Tim

Hi Tim;
Have you checked the turnouts with an NMRA gauge? Depending on the turnout #, there are some known issues with Atlas turnouts. Well worth a search on this group - just search for Atlas turnouts.

So what # is the turnouts causing the issues? Are the trucks having any binding issues in rotation?

Kind regards,
Bill

[thomasjmdavis]

The Atlas C55 in general is known for having the least clearance between the top of the rail and the various plastic bits (spikeheads, frogs, (whatever you call) the bits of plastic rail that lead into the frog. (Vs ME or Peco) I have no experience with LL Canada 424s and I don't know if they were produced to the same specs as LL US models, but I did have issues with my early LL SW9s and E units, which have somewhat deeper flanges than I would like. I had one #7 turnout on my previous layout in particular where those locos would "ground" going through the frog. Likewise early Katos- although they would generally bull their way through without stalls or derailments. I used a scriber to remove some plastic where wheels were making contact and it did help some.  But when I dismantled the layout, that turnout went in the trash, as I recall.  In Atlas defense, I had other Atlas C55 turnouts that most of my equipment negotiated without issue.

So, my first thought would be to take a close look at the turnout, and see if flanges are marking any of the plastic parts, or if there is any flash, that might be impeding the wheels.

[BCR 570]

No issues with the truck rotation.  Havent spent a lot of time on the turnouts yet as I assumed initially it was a loco issue, being specific to the C-425s and not others.

Tim

[djconway]

I know this may not be an easy fix but check the thickness of the wheels.
I have not had good luck with the Atlas #5 and #7 code 55 switches from the first runs, but I have found that different manufacturers flange to back of the wheel thickness are different. 

I'm not 100% sure but I think Atlas wheels are a few 1/1000ths thinner (it doesn't take much in N scale. )

[jjb62556]

I replaced the Atlas wheels with Kato wheels..they are a little wider but still work for me..

[jdcolombo]

Do what Bill said.  Check the turnout (the WHOLE THING!) with an NMRA gauge, particularly the gauge between the point and stock rails with the points set each way (for straight and diverging route) and the gauge between the guardrail and frog.

I had several Atlas #5 and #7 turnouts where the gauge between the point rail and stock rail was too narrow halfway between the entry to the turnout and the frog.  Had to file away a bit of the stock rail where the point rail snugs up to it to get the proper gauge.  I've also had a couple of #5's where the gauge between the guard rail and frog wasn't correct either.

All of my Atlas turnouts came from their first production run.

John C.

[nickelplate759]

Do what Bill said.  Check the turnout (the WHOLE THING!) with an NMRA gauge, particularly the gauge between the point and stock rails with the points set each way (for straight and diverging route) and the gauge between the guardrail and frog.

I had several Atlas #5 and #7 turnouts where the gauge between the point rail and stock rail was too narrow halfway between the entry to the turnout and the frog.  Had to file away a bit of the stock rail where the point rail snugs up to it to get the proper gauge.  I've also had a couple of #5's where the gauge between the guard rail and frog wasn't correct either.

All of my Atlas turnouts came from their first production run.

John C.

I've had that same problem on some Micro-Engineering turnouts too.   I'd say - ALWAYS check your turnouts, no matter what brand.

Another thought - might be worth a look under the trucks of the engine to ensure that nothing is hanging down or rubbing on the top of the frog.

[peteski]

I replaced the Atlas wheels with Kato wheels..they are a little wider but still work for me..

Kato wheels wider than Atlas?!  In the photo Atlss wheelset is on top, Kato on the bottom.



Katon not only have narrower thread, then have lower profile flange.

As for proper gauging, both brands are usually narrow from the factory, and  have to be spread out a bit to be NMRA compliant (as shown in the photo).

[jjb62556]

I mean the axles are wider as in your picture Peteski..

[peteski]

I mean the axles are wider as in your picture Peteski..

Ah ok.  The retrofit was discussed in https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=33107.0 (I borrowed the photo from that thread).

[mmagliaro]

Tim,
Having had many instances of steam locomotives getting "stuck" or "riding up" on Atlas 55 turnouts, I'll add my vote to check the turnout with the NMRA gauge.  Every bit of it.  Point rails, frog, guard rails.
Can you pop a truck out of an offending loco and just roll it through by hand? That might make it easier to see the problem.

[Skeebo]

      Two possible faults to check, I've noticed an occasional lack of quality control with Altas track, you might want to check that turnout for a rail that is not properly embedded in the plastic and therefore the bottom of the truck can catch on end of that piece of rail. Conversely you may want to check the bottom of the truck for flash on the bottom plate that can catch on a rail end that has a slight miss-match. Or even that the side frame part isn't fully snapped into the truck. As someone suggested earlier, take a truck off and hand roll it through the switch.

     Jim

[BCR 570]

Thank you all; yes I am going to have to spend some time gauging turnouts next, and maybe some filing is in order here and there.

I replaced the Atlas wheels with Kato wheels

So Kato wheels will fit into the C-424 mechanisms?

Tim

[Doug G.]

ALL commercial switches need to be inspected before installation. It's just the way it is. And, as a matter of fact, all commercial locomotives need to be inspected when new, also.

Doug