Bachmann S4's are hitting the shelves....

[brokemoto]

Honestly, im glad theyre making something i can start with in the first place. Lets think about this, without the 2-8-0, 2-6-6-2, 4-8-2, j class, 4-6-0, and now a 2-8-8-4, where would n-scale steam be?

You forgot the 2-6-0 which is also an excellent locomotive. 

I must agree, Bachpersonn is putting out both large and small steam.  B-mann is currently the only one that is bringing out new smaller steam.

For how long have we been clamouring for a decently operating ALCo yard goat?  We now have one and are about to get a second one.  At least I am assuming that both will operate decently.  Atlas, of course, has shown a high standard for years.  B-mann has improved to the point that I expect that its offering will operate well.  The SPECTRUM 2-8-0 was the first.  To be sure, there have been some missteps since then, but Bachmann paid heed to the problems that modellers cited and made the corrections (USRA light 4-8-2 and USRA 2-6-6-2).  The ten wheeler, mogul and both GEs are excellent.

The improvement in the B-mann is so marked that one stalwart here is wondering if he can replace a KATO with it.

I will try one.

Now, all that we need are decently operating FM and Lima yard goats.

[mecgp7]

Humph ... true-blue accurate N scalers who want REAL looking models know better than to buy ANY of the N scale stuff ever made, because all those models are well, WRONG!
These true-blue accurate N scalers are only trying to open the eyes of us dumb easily-duped clowns who actually BUY those inaccurate, impure models, bless their hearts. And it seems none of us appreciate their efforts. Sigh.

AMEN!

A little off topic, but:

N scale railroads are what I model,
Never call them toys.
They’re too important for that name.
And only fit for grown-up boys.

I’ll never get the one I want.
Clearly it should be done.
So they only built just 2 or 3,
I only need just one.

If only they’d listen,
Atlas, Kato and the like.
Each piece designed for me,
Just perfect for my pike

I’ll never buy another
From that company over there.
One time a wheel fell off,
Proof they just don’t care.

Will they ever get it right?
Each detail I should hope.
I see two rivets missing,
Straight through my microscope.

And the paint, oh the paint.
Will it ever be exact?
My opinion so important.
You see, it’s truly fact.

Finally, they made one.
Every detail you can see
What? No DCC you say.
On my layout it’ll never be!

Never pre-order.
Not me, no way.
Get it when they hit the shelves,
Or steal ‘em on Ebay

At last they got it right.
Thought I’d never see the day.
I don’t know what they’ll cost,
But it’s way too much to pay!

[Scottl]

 

[Specter3]

I read Jason's posts about " its crap" a couple times and someone calls him out and he finally details again why the model is not right. IIRC(and usually I dont these days, stupid medication) Jason, and a couple other folks have detailed the inaccuracies of the model. So to them, its already been hashed out, they are just reminding us of it. Its the old argument of if we buy everything they put out they will not bother to try and make it closer to prototypical. If we stop buying the crud that is not correct that will force them to make better stuff. I understand the sentiment but I dont think that it is ultimately realistic. Too many of us model times, places, and things in nscale that just dont exist that we have made do with what we could find for so long that when something that runs decently comes along that is pretty close we are happy. We have been programmed that way for a long time.

Ryan

[johnh35]

I saw it in person.  The hood is wide and it is not an accurate model of an Alco switcher.   

If proportion and detail don't bother you, fine.  But that doesn't somehow make the model correct.  This is Railwire and a lot of us are picky.

So, from your post I am guessing you do not own any Kato SD40/45's or SD7, or the Atlas GP30/35?

[DKS]

The truth of the matter is that there are no mass-produced N scale models that are 100% correct. Every one of them will have some kind of inaccuracy, be it due to production limitations, budget, oversights, physics, or whatever. It boils down to what level of inaccuracy one is willing to accept. Some will say that a loco with a wide hood but nice, fine handrails is worse than a loco with a correct hood width but stovepipes for handrails. Opinions by definition cannot be wrong, but depending on the circumstances they can be insulting. The risk is in making blanket condemnations about a company or product line, because the implication is that anyone who buys an "inferior" product is somehow an "inadequate" modeler--or vice-versa: those with higher expectations are somehow "elitist". Yes, we tend to be a bit fussier on the Railwire, but I think the larger issue is the way in which opinions are couched, because even here there's a range of skills present, as well as a range of sensibilities. Please take care with the manner in which objections are expressed. That applies to those on either side of any fence.

[Dave Schneider]

David,

Thanks for your words of wisdom. I think that this sums it up very well and explains many of the reasons for the recent rise in conflict in many of the product threads. Please, let's try to get along while trying to promote fine modeling.

Best wishes, Dave

[sizemore]

... because the implication is that anyone who buys an "inferior" product is somehow an "inadequate" modeler--or vice-versa: those with higher expectations are somehow "elitist". Yes, we tend to be a bit fussier on the Railwire, but I think the larger issue is the way in which opinions are couched, because even here there's a range of skills present, as well as a range of sensibilities. Please take care with the manner in which objections are expressed. That applies to those on either side of any fence.

+1

The S.

[Ntrainz1]

F7s coming.

EMD F7-A DIESEL LOCOMOTIVE
(DCC-EQUIPPED)
Suggested price: $115.00 each
SHIPPING SEPTEMBER 2013
The “bulldog” is back in an updated model. DCC-equipped for speed, direction, and lighting; all new drivetrain; precision motor; operating
LED headlight in A unit; teardrop windows; die-cast chassis; all-wheel pickup; and
E-Z Mate
®
Mark II couplers.

NS too.

Bob.

[kornellred]

I would bet that this thread will never become a PowerPoint presentation at a Bachmann Industries product development meeting.  It has always been clear that Bachmann has no need to play to the prototypical accuracy crowd.  Apparently, the corporate balance sheets indicate that their long-standing philosophy of "good enough" is still producing profits.

[kalbert]

I can sum up every product announcement pretty easily, they all head down the same path fairly quickly:

"I have not seen this model, but it is crap. It has crap hand rails. It has crap proportions. It has crap paint schemes. It has crap packaging. The decoder is crap. The company is crap. It's made in a crappy country. It's all crap. I know that it is crap, I don't have to see it. It is falsely advertised. It is a rip off of someone else's design. I won't buy it, nobody else should either. If you do you must be a dim wit playing with toys, clearly not serious about your model trains like me. I am the best modeler, I complain better than everyone here. That makes me better than you and this model crap."

Now repeat that about every 3rd post for 6 pages.

 

[Scottl]

I always thought of Bachmann as a train set-toy maker based on my childhood HO experiences, but my more recent experience with their On30 line suggests they have the capacity and interest to develop and product excellent products.  They have even gone as far as providing replacements for the cracked gears that plagued some of their locomotives in that scale.   So I have  no skin in the game for an old model switcher in n-scale, but interested to see what they can come up with.  Kato and Atlas have kept the bar fairly high and newcomers like Fox Valley are bringing excellent models to the table. 

[peteski]

As far as model companies go, to me, Kato is hard to beat.  They are not perfect (but as it has been said, no model company ever is).

Their models are still geared way too high, the paint schemes and colors are sometimes incorrect and some of the model details are not accurate.  But what makes a huge difference to me is their molding quality.  The crispiness and finely-molded delicate details of the shell details is what to me makes the model appear to be a true scale model rather than a toy.  The door lines (while they probably are) do not appear to be over sized like the grossly out of scale door lines on models from some other manufacturers.  Same goes for all the other molded details.  This fine detailing makes their models look right (even if not 100% accurate), while models from some other manufacturers seem to look like toys (even if their overall dimensions are more accurate than Kato's).

Maybe Japanese moldmakers are just better than others, because in a model car, and military model kit's world Tamiya seems to produce similar quality molds.  Theyjust  look right, and the parts fit is superb.

Kato's attention to detail is also apparent in the mechanical parts. Compared to other models, every mechanical part is finely molded. No flash or sharp ragged edges on metal parts or castings. Their gears have fine teeth and no excessive axle play.  While some of their mechanisms seem over-engineered, if they are treated with respect, they run like fine Swiss Japanese watches.  Kato also brought several innovation into N scale world which are still utilized, and which were copied by many others.

Thinking about this again, I have a similar opinion about Micro Trains.  The shells of their models have finely engraved details, which to me again make their models look right .  MT paint jobs are also done well. Paint is thin and well applied. The models themselves might be somewhat inaccurate, or sit too high on their trucks, or the paint jobs might be off, but the to me still look like miniature replicas rather than toys.  I don't care for their recent use of paint jet printers for decorating (the paint used by that printer is too thick and there is fuzziness of the graphics and CYMK ink dither) but I still hold MT in high regard with respect to overall quality of their models.

In the last 2 decades or so, other N scale manufacturers seem to have improved their products and they are catching up to Kato and MT. But IMO, none of them have become equal to those 2 manufacturers yet. Some of the manufacturers seem to make a step forward, then 2 steps back, while Kato and MT seem to consistently remain on the top. At least to me.

[sizemore]

To get this back onto the strengths and weaknesses of the S4 I took some quick happy-snaps of the little beasty with my cell phone. DOF is weak but between all the shots you get the idea:















Enjoy,
The S.

[delamaize]

Other than the windows, the handrails, and that boxing glove coupler, witch, except the windows, are easy fixes, I like it, and it looks good to me, I may buy one......

remember this is MODEL railroading, not OPEN-THE-BOX-AND-DROP-IT-ON-THE-RAIL-AND-DO-NOTHING railroading. if it's close, fix it to make it dead on.