operations in N scale?

[superchief]

The post that steamhostler had on switching made me think, How many of us have operations on our N scale layouts and what are the problems that you have run into and what were your solutions? What I would like to see is are you a lone wolf or operate with a group?, what type of car fowarding do you use?, communication system?, dispatching? and any other details you can think of. No way is right or wrong just want to see what you are doing. Thanks

I will start:   I have a large double deck layout, and run about 30 trains in a 4 hour session.
 
We use 9 operators  ( 1 dispatcher, 3 yards, 5 road crews)

I use Railop computer software for car forwarding   (this software is no longer supported so will most likely go to  4 cycle waybills with a picture of the car on the car card),

We switch off of car type and number

Telephone system for communications  (have used 5 channel headsets and FRS radios-like the phone the best),

Dispatching is on a magnet board for now/ I am slowing setting up JMRI on the computer (detection, and turnout control...signals later)

6" bamboo skewers for uncoupling

Digitrax DCC with radio throttles for the road/ tethered for the yards

Staging yards on both ends of the railroad, 3 track staging off the middle


My observations: few N scalers are into operations/ most like to run(orbit) trains (at least in my area)

HO guys or larger have a hard time reading n scale car numbers!!

need lots of labels on the fasica, and lot of crew instructions for a smooth run

car are light and need weight to track better

wayfreights are limited to 12 cars if using truck mounted couplers / road trains much longer

Ok guys tell us what you are doing and problems and solutions. Thanks, Gordon / Santa Fe-All the Way

[VonRyan]

I did some ops on my old HCD layout. I use Micro-Mark's car-cards and waybills.
On my N-Trak module, the ops plan is to exchange cars in shift bases, the frequency of the trains depends on the year being operated at the time.
On my new HCD layout that i'll probably begin working on soon enough, it will use the Micro-Mark car-cards and a modified version of the PRR's Local Freight Waybill. Trains will also use a switchlist to so which blocks of cars go where.

-Cody F.

[mark dance]

Hi all...

The C&W was designed for ops (yard/industrial, wayfreight, pusher and through freight ops) and I consider it one of my two main focuses in model railroading.  Videos explaining the C&W operations are on the  Youtube site including two introductory videos to train new operators:

and

Most of the regular C&W operators are HO'ers (exceptions for Railwire alumni Gary Hinshaw and Tim Horton).  The HO'ers have little difficulty adapting to the scale...well, much less then they thought they would!  The biggest problem they have is with uncoupling the “small, light cars”.  The N scalers have no problem with this at all.

A limitation I currently see in the C&W operations is something that actually only one visiting operator has brought up: the label-on-car car forwarding system.  Although the labels are visible in photos, operators seem to quickly learn to ignore them in operations...much like bare plywood.  However the labels *are* a problem for me as it takes me several hours to restage the 100's of cars on the layout because of them.  I am actively busy researching alternatives.

Hope that is valuable to the readers out there!

md

[seusscaboose]

BENCHWORK - large double deck layout
GRADE - 0-2% grade
RUNTIME - 75 minute point to point run-time at 30 scmp
# OF TRAINS - 8-10 trains
LENGTH OF SESSION: 4 hour session (12 hours fast clock).
OP'S PREFERENCE - Time Table way freight operations currently, plans for passenger in near future
TRACK - Atlas C55
WHEELSETS/COUPLERS - Fox Valley in Microtrain wheelsets for the most part
CREW: 7-8 operators  (1 dispatcher, 2 yards, 3 road crews, 1 hostler/extra)
PAPERWORK - 4 cycle waybills , Switching off of car type and number
COMMUNICATIONS - S&Y (Shout and Yell) system for communications  (there is a tentative plan to use 5 channel headsets)
DISPATCHING - Sheet (I have plans for detection, and turnout control...signals later)
CONTROL - Digitrax DCC with radio throttles for the road/ tethered for the yards
STAGING - 4 Track Staging yard on one end of the railroad (250 car capacity)
UNCOUPLING - 6" bamboo skewers / rix pix
TRAIN LIMITS - Way-freights are limited to 16 cars / Through-freights are much longer / Helper Service is always available when needed


OBSERVATIONS:
My observations: get a regular crew with friendly dispositions for a smooth run... trackwork is a given and automatic turnouts are highly encouraged... Oh.. and a good power supply that will support the old "quarter test" 

more updates here: https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=22095.0
EP

[superchief]

Mark great information, love the videos.....I have used the old tabs on cars and the "avery dots" how do you like the label system? your video noted a long "restage time" is this due to the labels? i also have a long restage time and is something I would like to shorten. Thanks, Gordon

[kc9jts]

I was starting to have operations on my 3x5 layout before I moved.  As I am talking about my new layout on the Layout Engineering Board I will keep this related to my old layout:

Benchwork: plywood table
Control: Cab control (layout could only accommodate a max of 2 trains at a time.)
Car forwarding: Micro-Mark system; as I had a classification yard at both ends of the subdivision my layout is based on I hadn't broken the blocking down beyond "north", "south", "local", or "interchange".  Done based on car reporting marks & number.
number of operators: 2 at most; usually just me due to small size
fast clock: none
communications: holler across the room

Issues:
The only real issue I had was a curve I made too tight (due to the size of the layout) and the weight of the cars.  Once I got used to handling N-scale cars though switching wasn't much of an issue and wasn't really any different than operating on a HO scale layout.  Note: about the time I was really starting to get things rolling it was time to pack up and move; so most of the operations stuff remains in a box.

Nick
omaha

[mark dance]

Mark great information, love the videos.....I have used the old tabs on cars and the "avery dots" how do you like the label system? your video noted a long "restage time" is this due to the labels? i also have a long restage time and is something I would like to shorten. Thanks, Gordon

thx Gordon. 

Yes the restaging is due to having the labels.  While they get rid of the need for carrying and handling car cards, or for generating switchlists and dealing with miss spot cars, they do require that either the cars or labels be "reset" at the end of each session which is where the time comes in.  4 cycle car cards just need to be turned to give the cars their new routing but then you need to carry cards for each car, have places to store these cards, have unique car numbers and finally really good eyes...oh yeah even that isn't enough when you have yard tracks on 13' centers full of 40' brown box cars 'cause you can't see the numbers anyway! 

I am still looking for a solution acceptable to me and the operators around here.  In the meantime the only one it sems to bother is the superintendent who has to set the layout up.

md

[superchief]

thanks Mark, it takes me about 3 hrs to do the paperwork upfront of the session, at the end I "flip" each train in staging, run an "inventory" about an hour/ downside on the computer if the operator fails to get the car to the right spot you "must" move the car on the layout or in the computer. My main yard at Argentine holds about 88 cars and at least a 1/4 are 40' brown ATSF!!!!!the orange reefers come in a close second. My regular operators run about 90% to 95% correct, the Prorail guys were 99% and one perfect session where all cars were correct. Normally one crewmembers "flips" all the trains while I do the inventory after the session. The paperwork part is what I want to reduce, I have used car cards on other layouts but I would not use them without the photo of the car, and I have had a 35 car coal drag and thats a lot of car cards to hold. I really liked your paperwork on the clipboard/ lanyard around your neck, a guy in OK does that with the throttles. Looking for different ideas and opinons to try as always tryinh to improve the sessions. Great info!! Thanks, Gordon

[John]

For the 35 car coal drags - run them with one car=card and keep the cars together

[peteski]

Yes, on some layouts I operate on, coal drags or container trains are "unit trains" and they only have single car card per train.

[sdodge]

My 3' x 7 ' freelance shortline and logging road has been in continous operation for 17 years.
- One or 2 operators
- 2 cab DC
- Traditional benchwork
- 8-10 car trains
- 3 yards to switch
- Use the Rix Pic for uncoupling, no magnets
- Use a free inventory program that prints car cards
- I also use the unit train concept with one car card for logging trains
- I have problems with tight curves. Cannot run Bluford 86' box cars!

[MichaelWinicki]

A full operating session would be 24 trains, moving about 330 cars.

I use Railop and use the actual car numbers.

We have very few problems with car numbers not being able to be read or with cars ending up in the wrong place. 

I think there are three factors that have helped shape the success we've had...

The first is almost of the switching trackage is within 12" of the layout edge... Including all the classifcation tracks in the yard.   It makes it a heck of a lot easier to read N-scale car numbers when the cars are that close.

The second is that everything is illuminated... and well illuminated at that.  The layout, the aisles.   I didn't want operators to have to refocus their eyes on paperwork in a slightly darker aisleway and then have to read car numbers in a very bright environment.

The third is that most of the switches are caboose industry throws, which means the operator doesn't have to lose focus from watching their trains.  They don't have to take a step back, read the schematic on the fascia, push a button and then step forward again to follow their train.

With Railop, setup time for 24 trains is about 1/2 an hour to check car locations and about an hour to print off the manifests for the next operating session.  I like the randomness of the program, meaning that cars are not stuck on any sort of a "cycle", nor do I have to put any sort of marker or pin on them.

[mark dance]

...I use Railop and use the actual car numbers.

We have very few problems with car numbers not being able to be read or with cars ending up in the wrong place.  ...

Interesting.  How high is your benchwork, if I might ask Michael, and what is the track to track spacing in the class yard?

thx

md

[MichaelWinicki]

Hey Mark...

48" lower deck & 62" upper deck.

The yard tracks are 1 1/4" apart– being on the lower deck and close to the layout edge, the person operating the yard usually has a pretty good viewing angle. 

I've got a 3 track yard on the upper deck that sometimes requires a little "car jostling" to read car numbers if they have too.  But it's a small yard and Railop specifies which track a car should be on, so usually the operator of that segment can simply go by which RR name is on the car.

[SkipGear]

I have been operating on a friends basement sized layout. It is in essence a giant 3 turn helix. The return loop for the bottom yard/staging is directly under the return for upper yard/staging. NCE DCC system. Normal 3 hour session (12 hours on a 4:1 fast clock) is around 15-20 trains. The layout models the B&O from Cincinnati to Chilicothe around 1950 and follows the actual timetable as much as possible for the primary trains. About 1/4 of the layout is double tracked with the rest being single track and passing sidings.

Right now operations are still in the early stages. Primarily running on a schedule and train orders working the bugs out of things. As things progress there is an interchange point, industrial yard, and two branches to service that will be included.

This is the first layout I have ever done operations on and it is more interesting than expected. I initially joined in to help out as he needed bodies to run trains but now I am eager for the next session, which right now is held off for a month or so as electronics are being modified to cure some overloads on one of the 4 boosters on the layout.