gluing down track ballast

[Flatrat]

I'll open up another can of worms here. I ordered Peco c55 flex track for my run around loop on the new layout with the hopes that my heritage n stuff will run well on it. I will have to bury the big ties in ballast to get the look I'm after. I used a diluted mix of white glue with a drop or two of dish detergent "back in the day" of Altas C80 for dribbling down on to the ballast material to glue the ballast in place. I did a search on "ballast" on railwire but came up empty for links.

Without, hopefully, causing heated debate, what are the current best mixes and methods for gluing down ballast. What ballast looks good, coarse/fine/color, etc. for the transition days of steam to diesel and what glue mixture should i try?

If we can kill two birds with one stone on this post, what are the favorite methods for painting rails these days?

[DKS]

Many of us here have settled on the following: after spreading and shaping the ballast, dribble on plain old rubbing alcohol so that all of the ballast has been wetted. Then dribble on a 50-50 mix of white glue and water until the ballast is totally saturated (a few small puddles of glue here and there are OK; larger accumulations can be picked up with the edge of a paper towel). You can increase the drying time many fold by placing a fan nearby that blows across the fresh ballast.

There are some who use matte medium as the bonding agent; I've found that it tends to create whitish globs ("snots" I call 'em) here and there. It's also much harder to loosen ballast bonded with matte medium, should the need arise. White glue will let go after being soaked with water in just a few minutes.

My preferred method of painting track is to spray it before ballasting with roof brown. Then I'll give the ties some individuality by tinting some with India ink wash, and others with a very dilute light grey wash. I may then apply Rail Brown or even Weathered Black to the rails, depending on their locale and upkeep. After the ballast is applied and dry, I'll lightly brush on some powdered chalk to make subtle rust and oil stains.

As to the ballast itself, I'll leave it to others to make recommendations.

Incidentally, I recently discovered a technique that makes ballast spreading go faster. Take a clean, dry 3" paintbrush. Hold it so that the handle is vertical, with the bristles centered over and in line with the track, not across it. Run the brush gently along the center of the track. If you're lucky, the ballast will be shaped right in one or two passes. Then you simply need to shape the sloping sides.

[Flatrat]

Thanks Dave.

You are using the alcohol as a 'wetting agent' or just find it settles the ballast down prior to gluing? Does the alcohol need to be applied right before gluing or can you glue later on? What ballast do you prefer? Brand, coarseness?

I've also read some tips of using floquil paint markers for painting track or using rust colored paint and a fine paint brush. what works best from your experience?

[DKS]

Thanks Dave.

You are using the alcohol as a 'wetting agent' or just find it settles the ballast down prior to gluing? Does the alcohol need to be applied right before gluing or can you glue later on? What ballast do you prefer? Brand, coarseness?

I've also read some tips of using floquil paint markers for painting track. what works best from your experience?

The alcohol is the wetting agent; apply the glue immediately after applying the alcohol, since it will evaporate and you'll lose the wetting effect.

I edited my post with my own personal painting techniques, so just hit refresh to see them. Others will chime in with any number of painting variations.

As for ballast, I use an odd brand: minitec, which I order direct from Germany. I use their Z scale ballast for N scale, as it seems to look best to my eye. May others will recommend Smith & Sons or Arizona blah blah (I've forgotten). Here's a sample of some recent ballasting I've done:

[Flatrat]

Looks very realistic.

I guess, like other projects it's best to work in small sections at a time applying the alcohol and then the glue mix.

[DKS]

Looks very realistic.

I guess, like other projects it's best to work in small sections at a time applying the alcohol and then the glue mix.

Yes; I usually stick to lengths of track about three to four feet long.

[Flatrat]

Do you paint your track and stain the ballast after ballasting is glued down?

[LV LOU]

Many of us here have settled on the following: after spreading and shaping the ballast, dribble on plain old rubbing alcohol so that all of the ballast has been wetted. Then dribble on a 50-50 mix of white glue and water until the ballast is totally saturated (a few small puddles of glue here and there are OK; larger accumulations can be picked up with the edge of a paper towel). You can increase the drying time many fold by placing a fan nearby that blows across the fresh ballast.

There are some who use matte medium as the bonding agent; I've found that it tends to create whitish globs ("snots" I call 'em) here and there. It's also much harder to loosen ballast bonded with matte medium, should the need arise. White glue will let go after being soaked with water in just a few minutes.

My preferred method of painting track is to spray it before ballasting with roof brown. Then I'll give the ties some individuality by tinting some with India ink wash, and others with a very dilute light grey wash. I may then apply Rail Brown or even Weathered Black to the rails, depending on their locale and upkeep. After the ballast is applied and dry, I'll lightly brush on some powdered chalk to make subtle rust and oil stains.

As to the ballast itself, I'll leave it to others to make recommendations.

Incidentally, I recently discovered a technique that makes ballast spreading go faster. Take a clean, dry 3" paintbrush. Hold it so that the handle is vertical, with the bristles centered over and in line with the track, not across it. Run the brush gently along the center of the track. If you're lucky, the ballast will be shaped right in one or two passes. Then you simply need to shape the sloping sides.

I pretty much do just about exactly what Dave does,but I do use Matte Medium or Woodland Scenics Ballast Cement.They dry with a much flatter finish.You use alcohol because when it dries,it's gone,just like the water.If you use dish soap,once it's dry,it's still dish soap,sticky forever..
 

[babbo_enzo]

Many of us here have settled on the following: after spreading and shaping the ballast, dribble on plain old rubbing alcohol so that all of the ballast has been wetted. Then dribble on a 50-50 mix of white glue and water until the ballast is totally saturated (a few small puddles of glue here and there are OK; larger accumulations can be picked up with the edge of a paper towel). You can increase the drying time many fold by placing a fan nearby that blows across the fresh ballast.

Some time ago I've upload this short movie made by a good friend:
More or less same procedure, but with some differences .
 

[MichaelWinicki]

Yep, using rubbing alcohol as a wetting agent seems to be a big improvement over adding a little dish-soap to water.

Made ballasting my track a pleasure rather than a pain.

[DKS]

... You can increase the drying time many fold by placing a fan nearby that blows across the fresh ballast.

Brain fart. That should be "decrease the drying time..." Instead of waiting overnight for it to dry, with a fan it'll be dry in a couple of hours.

[PAL_Houston]

There is really no reason for separate steps.  After you mix the 50:50 white glue in hot water, add about 10% isopropyl alcohol directly to this mixture.  You now have a one-step wetting and bonding mix that you can apply with an eye-dropper.

[Bendtracker1]

Paul, I'd have to agree with DKS and Michael,

Applying the Alcohol first then the glue mixture works better for me.
I've had the all-in-one mixture ball up for just a second or two before soaking in the ballast, thus resulting in small divots in the ballast before it starts to soak in.  If the alcohol is applied first, it will flow into the ballast easily, then there is next to zero tension when the glue mixture hits.

It just saves having to go back and touch up any divots.

[LV LOU]

Paul, I'd have to agree with DKS and Michael,

Applying the Alcohol first then the glue mixture works better for me.
I've had the all-in-one mixture ball up for just a second or two before soaking in the ballast, thus resulting in small divots in the ballast before it starts to soak in.  If the alcohol is applied first, it will flow into the ballast easily, then there is next to zero tension when the glue mixture hits.

It just saves having to go back and touch up any divots.

I find that also.I'd never do it in one step,it doesn't come out as nice,the ballast takes a little longer to soak it up,makes it do goofy things..Also,since I use the same 93% alcohol I use for stripping paint off shells,I dilute it at least 50% with water,and I do add maybe 10% to the glue/water mix.

[diezmon]

The only thing I do differently is I use windshield washer fluid as my wetting agent.  In fact, most times I don't even need to prewet.. I just mix in white glue with the fluid.  It doesn't leave a sheen at all that I've ever noticed..