ESM launches Sovereign Modeler Series™ on 12/7

[sizemore]

I hear sand in someone's Va-jay-jay.

Don't like it. Don't buy it. Either way, you still have to admit the weathering looks good.

The S.

[TrainCat2]

I'm sure this car is not in the $6-10 range even without the weathering.  But that ridge of plastic posing as a grab shouts $10.00 to me.

Chester (Inkaneer),

You done this to several people including me. Why do you feel the need to criticize others and their endeavours. You talk the trash, why don't you step up to the plate and let's see what you can produce.

****************************

Tom & Bryan, this is clearly what you get when two masters come together. Kudos to you both!!

[DKS]

You're not paying for a gon.

You're paying for a Tom Mann original.

Thanks but no thanks.  If a Van Gogh original then maybe.

I suppose you can't take rejection either.

It has nothing to do with rejection. It has everything to do with knowing when to keep thy trap shut.

[AlkemScaleModels]

This discussion reminds me of common reaction I get in my custom model business. Many people just don't value the craftsmanship that goes into a finely built, hand made model. They have no trouble paying a car mechanic $80 a hour to change oil, but balk at $20 an hour for one-of-a-kind model work.

I think the Sovereign Model idea is an interesting concept. I see it appealing more to collectors more than runners, but I could be wrong. It will be fun to watch it evolve.

[oakcreekco]

This is a great idea IMO, and for a variety of reasons.

Not all of us have the skills/eye that Tom does. I'm sure that many have tried, and results were from "so so" to "killer". This series will enable folks to buy that "perfectly done" car that they want, but their skill level wouldn't allow.

The time factor also plays a role for some too. They may have the money, but not the time to "produce" a model like this.

Of course there's "price", and that comes up in ANY hobby. Some folks have the funding, and some don't. That's just life. It seems far easier for some to start "talking crap" about a product/company, because they can't afford it. They don't want to admit that " I don't have the money to spend on this", so raising hell is their "option".

I hope that this is successful to all involved, and once again, we have another fine "choice" in "N" scale products.

[Mark5]

To me, this falls into the same sort of category as custom painted locos, etc.

It takes someone time to this stuff, and time is often money ...

The product's not for me, but there certainly is a market of some sort for this stuff.

Mark

[inkaneer]

I'm sure this car is not in the $6-10 range even without the weathering.  But that ridge of plastic posing as a grab shouts $10.00 to me.

Chester (Inkaneer),

You done this to several people including me. Why do you feel the need to criticize others and their endeavours. You talk the trash, why don't you step up to the plate and let's see what you can produce.

Excuse me but I thought this was a forum for general discussion where people posted their opinions.  So I posted my opinion on the car.  Notice I said nothing about the weathering job.  My only complaint was that for 27 dollars for the basic car one would expect to find wire grabs instead of a ridge of plastic.  A ridge of plastic I would expect on an Atlas Trainman line of car.  But excuse me if this is a mutual admiration society where diparaging words are not heard and where praise is so cheap that it is bandied about willy nilly.  Villify me all you want but when I was in business I would rather have one person tell me what is wrong with my product rather than ten "yes men" who will blow smoke up my butt because I know that for every one that dares to tell me his opinion and every ten who are the brown nosers there are an additional 25 or more who will say nothing at all and would just simply walk away without buying the product.  That is my take on it but hey, I'll leave you all to your mutual back slapping and your atta boys.

[wm3798]

You're right.  A hand-assembled multi-casting car with interior rivet detail, body mounted couplers, full end detail and heavily researched paint schemes that costs $27 should also have wire grabs that in the end would look too big and add another $5 to the cost.  Good thinking.

I'll take it that since you say you "were" in business, that for some reason it didn't work out...  If ESM goes belly up on account of a couple of molded on grabs, I'm sure you'll be the first one Bryan calls for advice on how to close out the books properly.

Lee

[wcfn100]

You're right.  A hand-assembled multi-casting car with interior rivet detail, body mounted couplers, full end detail and heavily researched paint schemes that costs $27 should also have wire grabs that in the end would look too big and add another $5 to the cost.  Good thinking.

Circling the wagons aside... Let's not start down any path that makes it sound like the detail in question is more to scale because it's molded on.  The molded grab measures the same as an Intermountain F-unit grab.



Jason

[Mark5]

Of course you know this means war!

[DKS]

I'm sure this car is not in the $6-10 range even without the weathering.  But that ridge of plastic posing as a grab shouts $10.00 to me.

Chester (Inkaneer),

You done this to several people including me. Why do you feel the need to criticize others and their endeavours. You talk the trash, why don't you step up to the plate and let's see what you can produce.

Excuse me but I thought this was a forum for general discussion where people posted their opinions.  So I posted my opinion on the car.  Notice I said nothing about the weathering job.  My only complaint was that for 27 dollars for the basic car one would expect to find wire grabs instead of a ridge of plastic.  A ridge of plastic I would expect on an Atlas Trainman line of car.  But excuse me if this is a mutual admiration society where diparaging words are not heard and where praise is so cheap that it is bandied about willy nilly.  Villify me all you want but when I was in business I would rather have one person tell me what is wrong with my product rather than ten "yes men" who will blow smoke up my butt because I know that for every one that dares to tell me his opinion and every ten who are the brown nosers there are an additional 25 or more who will say nothing at all and would just simply walk away without buying the product.  That is my take on it but hey, I'll leave you all to your mutual back slapping and your atta boys.

Of all the forums where I lurk, The Railwire is likely the least prone to backslapping and attaboys. Maybe if it's repeated often enough, it might get through to you: it's not the fact that you express your opinion; it's the delivery. It carries a sarcastic tone that removes it from the realm of objective criticism, which understandably puts people on the defensive.

Also, take note that criticism is more readily accepted from those who have earned a level of respect. Just as one must earn the praise of peers with genuinely good modeling, one must also earn the respect of those same peers in order for one's criticism to carry weight. I'm not seeing either in this situation.

[Chris333]

I has seen a lot of Micro Trains cars sell for over $27 and they didn't have half the detail.

[Mark5]

I has seen a lot of Micro Trains cars sell for over $27 and they didn't have half the detail.

And the gons can't take a scale 50' load either.

Mark

[Dave V]

I'm probably not going to buy one of these, but not because I don't feel it isn't worth it.  It's just not in my hobby budget right now.

I already have a pair of G26 gons, and as I said before, they are fantastic cars!  My naked eye is not offended by any of the molded-on detail.  In fact, the detail is far crisper than I've seen elsewhere.  It's new tooling to be sure, so I don't know what role that plays.

As for rejection, I wouldn't know...  Never had to deal with it!

In all seriousness, constructive criticism is a useful tool...  with constructive being the operative word.  Great gon, great weathering job, nothing in my mind to bash here.  Price-wise, I can't say.  I honestly don't know how to value hard work, time, and materials for this kind of custom job.  I'd have trouble believing that no one would buy these.

Is ESM going to recruit Rich Yourstone?

[tom mann]

Guys, lets take a step back for a minute and relax!

(and I was hoping for 3 pages of pre orders!  :-\ )