So Long, My Friend

[wm3798]

Regarding collecting chunks of layouts...  I've thought about this, but I wonder what it would really accomplish.  The one preservation effort I'm aware of that makes sense is the recently restored/renovated Clinchfield layout.  That's an example of a model railroad that can be fully preserved, maintained, displayed and operated.  The brilliance of the original design is easily evident because it's preserved in context. 

While it would be nice to have a section of, say, the Reid Bros. layout, would be able to represent the whole of the layout?  Could that section of foam and plaster truly demonstrate that the layout was not only beautifully executed, but it also was a good representation of a modeled transportation system?

Where does the "art" of the model railroad begin and end?  Scenery is merely a fraction of the effort that goes into designing and building a model railroad.  I mean, would having a chunk of Marilyn Monroe's leg give you an idea of how beautiful she was?

Just wandering through an idea here...

Lee

[Sokramiketes]

Regarding collecting chunks of layouts...  I've thought about this, but I wonder what it would really accomplish.  The one preservation effort I'm aware of that makes sense is the recently restored/renovated Clinchfield layout.  That's an example of a model railroad that can be fully preserved, maintained, displayed and operated.  The brilliance of the original design is easily evident because it's preserved in context. 

While it would be nice to have a section of, say, the Reid Bros. layout, would be able to represent the whole of the layout?  Could that section of foam and plaster truly demonstrate that the layout was not only beautifully executed, but it also was a good representation of a modeled transportation system?

Where does the "art" of the model railroad begin and end?  Scenery is merely a fraction of the effort that goes into designing and building a model railroad.  I mean, would having a chunk of Marilyn Monroe's leg give you an idea of how beautiful she was?

Just wandering through an idea here...

Lee

The BIG PICTURE is what is generally preserved in print.  In the case of the Reid Brother's, it's the articles and videos that cover the design, the building, the transportation system as a whole...  What you don't get from there is a true understanding of the techniques.  How perfect is the placement of a rock casting?  How much of the highlights on that rock casting are lighting and how much is painted in place? 

It's like studying a painting up close and being able to see the brush strokes.  When you stand back, the whole painting is one story.  The up close study of techniques/tendencies/methods is a whole nother story.  A chunk-o-layout is only a piece, but it tells a much different story than an overview of the whole.  A Rich Yourstone boxcar masterpiece (or Tom Mann, or Mellow Mike, or Bill Reid...) tells a whole different story in your hands than it does in published photos. 

The Clinchfield is probably different from anything I'd save, as it's been restored.  Don't get me wrong, it's fantastic that it still tours, runs, is well cared for, etc.  The overall design still comes through as the BIG PICTURE.  But, it's probably hard to figure out what Gordon's tendencies as a modeler are anymore, at least from the scenery aspect.  I guess it would be like touching up DaVinci's "Last Supper" to fix the missing portions and brighten the colors up again. 

Is it too much of a stretch to compare the work of the Reid's, or Lance, or Mike Danneman to a DaVinci?  Maybe this century. 

[Ed Kapuscinski]

I agree with Mike here. I think that we, as a group, don't appreciate our own history nearly enough.

I wish someone had grabbed chunks of Tony K's AM before it was all gone. Same thing with the V&O. Those were groundbreaking for me, and I'd love to see parts preserved, for the same reason (well, similar reasons), why I think it's important to preserve prototype artifacts.

Sure, you can read that Rails Northeast from the 80s to learn about CR's SD40-2 helpers, but if you really want to understand about them, sometimes it helps to see them.

A few weeks back I had a chance to help with the restoration of a piece of the Canadaigua Southern. I think it may be some of my most important work to date.

[ñiao]

Is it too much of a stretch to compare the work of the Reid's, or Lance, or Mike Danneman to a DaVinci?  Maybe this century. 

No, I don't think it is. Interesting that you bring up DaVinci. His seemingly endless multitude of talents mirror the talents "expected" from a model railroader very well (IMHO).

[Zox]

No, I don't think it is. Interesting that you bring up DaVinci. His seemingly endless multitude of talents mirror the talents "expected" from a model railroader very well (IMHO).

Agreed.

Then again, if DaVinci had not done "real art" (his paintings), would we ever have heard of him or his other talents?

In any era, fame is largely about eye candy...

[ñiao]

Maybe not so much to the general public (I wonder who has heard of him before the DaVinci Code ) as it is nowadays. However, in Europe he is most famous as THE renaissance man on which his contemporaries are measured. His notes have left a huge impact on engineering, science and art history until today.
To my highschool times, he was topic in physics, biology, math, history, art, even religion classes. Even in engineering school (dropped out) he was mentioned oftentimes.
So, no, for Europeans at least it is less the eye candy. 

[CVSNE]

I agree with Mike here. I think that we, as a group, don't appreciate our own history nearly enough.

I wish someone had grabbed chunks of Tony K's AM before it was all gone. Same thing with the V&O. Those were groundbreaking for me, and I'd love to see parts preserved, for the same reason (well, similar reasons), why I think it's important to preserve prototype artifacts.

Sure, you can read that Rails Northeast from the 80s to learn about CR's SD40-2 helpers, but if you really want to understand about them, sometimes it helps to see them.

A few weeks back I had a chance to help with the restoration of a piece of the Canadaigua Southern. I think it may be some of my most important work to date.

Pieces of (both versions) V&O have been saved - some are being incorporated into other layouts, some are at that "Howell Day Museum" out in California. The pieces of the original V&O look to be me like an old model railroad - without the context of the greater whole there's no context.

Tony told me once he thought about saving some piece of the AM but couldn't come up with one signature scene that would make sense out of context with the rest of the railroad. He did save the Sunrise engine terminal, including the Tichy coaling tower. Don't know what he plans to do with it though.

Maybe that's the difference between a layout and some form of art like a painting - after all, we don't save just a "chunk" of the Last Supper and throw the rest away - we (usually) try to save the entire piece so future generations can see it in context.

Oh, and I think it's a real stretch to compare any model railroader to DaVinci.

Marty


Marty


Marty

[Zox]

Oh, and I think it's a real stretch to compare any model railroader to DaVinci.

Marty

I dunno. Look at how many things DaVinci dreamed up, and even drew detailed plans for, but never actually built.

Sounds like a typical armchair modeler to me...

[ñiao]

Oh, and I think it's a real stretch to compare any model railroader to DaVinci.

Marty

If you see it more as a figure of speech than literally, it isn't much of a stretch.
We are obsessed with machines and their MO, we observe nature and copy it while trying to understand it. We are draftsmen, painters, sculpturists, ... in short, we have multiple talents all melted together in one hobby, so, in one way or the other, we all are DaVincis.

[AlkemScaleModels]

Oh, and I think it's a real stretch to compare any model railroader to DaVinci.

Marty

If you see it more as a figure of speech than literally, it isn't much of a stretch.
We are obsessed with machines and their MO, we observe nature and copy it while trying to understand it. We are draftsmen, painters, sculpturists, ... in short, we have multiple talents all melted together in one hobby, so, in one way or the other, we all are DaVincis.

 I always have a hard time distinguishing between craft and art. If art is  something presented with skill and imagination to be shared with others, as some suggest it is,  then model railroads qualify.  I think a model railroad executed at a high standard qualifies as art.

I have seen some real trash presented as art, say at the Torpedo Factory in Alexandria, while just down the street, Paul Dolkos' layout was clearly a work of art.

[ñiao]

Oh, and I think it's a real stretch to compare any model railroader to DaVinci.

Marty

If you see it more as a figure of speech than literally, it isn't much of a stretch.
We are obsessed with machines and their MO, we observe nature and copy it while trying to understand it. We are draftsmen, painters, sculpturists, ... in short, we have multiple talents all melted together in one hobby, so, in one way or the other, we all are DaVincis.

 I always have a hard time distinguishing between craft and art. If art is  something presented with skill and imagination to be shared with others, as some suggest it is,  then model railroads qualify.  I think a model railroad executed at a high standard qualifies as art.

I have seen some real trash presented as art, say at the Torpedo Factory in Alexandria, while just down the street, Paul Dolkos' layout was clearly a work of art.

In German is a word "Kunsthandwerk" which translates into art-craft. Mostly, it is used for those guys making wrought iron fences, grave statues, engravings, souvenirs, ... this is how I see model trains.

This forum is a terrific art gallery, btw. I wish I had your guys' talents.  :'(