Author Topic: Assembling GHQ Kits  (Read 1099 times)

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BCR751

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Assembling GHQ Kits
« on: July 25, 2023, 02:49:38 PM »
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Has anyone tried soldering GHQ pewter kits?  I'm having no luck at all with CA and epoxy is too difficult to properly position.

Doug

wazzou

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2023, 04:17:43 PM »
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The Britannia Pewter has a very low melting point.  Don't do it.
ACC works just fine. 
I'd recommend roughing up the area to be joined with some sand paper to provide some extra tooth.
Bryan

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Lemosteam

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #2 on: July 25, 2023, 07:01:32 PM »
+1
Agree on soldering- tried it ruined an engine cab.

You might try some UV resin glue. Lots of time for adjustment, and no touch hardening when you have the parts where you want them.

Also makes a great file-able filler in part gaps.

Simon D.

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2023, 06:21:37 AM »
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Have you tried a CA accelerator?  I find it really helps to ensure the bond is firm.

thomasjmdavis

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2023, 09:08:23 AM »
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Using a "thick" or "gel" CA can also be helpful- the mating surface between 2 cast metal parts is not as "tight" as injection molded styrene parts.
Tom D.

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robert3985

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #5 on: July 27, 2023, 11:58:49 AM »
+2
Although CA will work on pewter models, ya gotta make sure that you completely de-grease the parts before assembling, and use Nitrile gloves to avoid getting skin oils on the parts while handling.

I've found that using CA Accelerator greatly strengthens the joint.

For de-greasing, I use a bath in Heptane (Bestine) Rubber Cement Thinner, and washing lastly with Dawn dishwashing liquid and warm/hot water.  I've used Brakleen brake parts cleaner too, and it works very well, but is really stinky.

As has been said already, roughing up mating surfaces will always enhance glued joints.

However, for models that I'm gonna be handling a lot, such as a car or an engine conversion, I am now using a quality 5 min Epoxy for my white metal glue.  Works great and is much stronger than CA.

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

Sokramiketes

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #6 on: July 27, 2023, 01:39:17 PM »
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I've found that using CA Accelerator greatly strengthens the joint.

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

For some reason, I haven't moved to using CA Accelerator.  I see guys, like Adam Savage, do speed builds with it.  And even wood workers who want a fast grab but also use wood glue for the permanent joint. 

But, the heresay I heard back when I worked at a hobby shop was that the accelerator sped up the cure, for sure, but weakened the joint over time because it triggered the crystallization structure in a different manner than would happen with a slow cure. 

I call it heresay because I don't even remember reading that anywhere.  So what say the collective? 

wazzou

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #7 on: July 27, 2023, 02:10:06 PM »
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I have a small can of it (Zip Kicker) and use it only occasionally when fiddly bits are difficult to maintain in their position with a slower cure.
Robert's claim that they strengthen a joint is the first time I'd really heard that, to be honest.
Bryan

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MK

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2023, 05:38:09 PM »
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Accelerator neither strengthens or weakens the CA bonds.  I fly R/C airplanes and we use it all the time.  Strength is more important in R/C flying than MRR and there have been no reports that accelerators weakens (or strengthens) CA bonds.

Sokramiketes

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2023, 11:37:24 AM »
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"It's important to note that adding too much accelerator will reduce the adhesive's tensile strength, so you should always follow product guidelines closely to ensure you're applying the correct amount."

https://info.aronalpha.net/blog/super-glue-accelerators-key-considerations-how-to-apply-them#:~:text=A%20firm%20bond%20will%20quickly,re%20applying%20the%20correct%20amount.

Well, there's some truth to what I heard.  Then, how much is too much?

BCR 570

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #10 on: July 28, 2023, 04:55:06 PM »
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Hi Doug

I have assembled a few of these now and as mentioned:
- thick gap- filling CA; preferably fresh
- file mating surfaces for best fur possible


I tend to have difficulty with CA when it has been sitting around for several months after being opened.



Tim
T. Horton
North Vancouver, B.C.
BCR Dawson Creek Subdivision in N Scale
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MK

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #11 on: July 28, 2023, 04:58:47 PM »
+1
I tend to have difficulty with CA when it has been sitting around for several months after being opened.

After opening a fresh bottle, keep the rest in the freezer between uses.  Before using from freezer, let it warm up to room temperature for 5 minutes or so (bottles are usually small).

wazzou

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #12 on: July 28, 2023, 06:01:00 PM »
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I tend to have difficulty with CA when it has been sitting around for several months after being opened.

Tim

I just put the opened bottles in the Fridge.  Works great.
Bryan

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mu26aeh

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #13 on: July 28, 2023, 07:15:49 PM »
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We store all our CA in fridge at the shop.  Really confuses customers when they can't find it.  "Can't believe you guys don't stock super glue"

Ah, you want thin, medium, thick.  Small medium or large ??

robert3985

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Re: Assembling GHQ Kits
« Reply #14 on: July 29, 2023, 02:08:59 PM »
+1
I got started using cyanoacrylate adhesive when I started professionally building historic wooden sailing ship models while in the Navy stationed in Charleston SC in the mid 1970's.  Only one company sold it at the time...Kodak...and it was called "Eastman 910"...then later "Kodak Superglue".  It allowed me to make scale diameter masts, yards and spars from various types of wood that by soaking them with the runny stuff, would be greatly structurally strengthened without affecting the real wood appearance of the part very much.  Having these prototypically slim parts also enhanced the prototype appearance of my models, which was one of my selling points.

There were popularly two ways of setting CA off quickly...one way was to powder the inside of your structure, that wouldn't be observed, with Baking Soda, which would set it off with a crack and a puff of highly stinky, eye/nose irritating smoke or possibly steam.  The other way, which I preferred, was to blow on it...or rather exhale on it, with my mouth open for the most moisturized exhaled air...making sure not to inhale!

The best way to keep moisture away from it (because moisture is what sets it off) was to insert a hypodermic needle into the nose of the bottle applicator, let the glue set off in the stainless hypo needed after applying the glue, then heating the tip of the needle with a lighter to cook it out the next time I needed to use it.  Worked very well and made for an automatic seal for the tiny plastic bottle.

After CA became more popular, Accelerator came into general usage, which greatly increased the appeal of various brands of CA, and much reduced the hazard of CA fumes irritating my eyes or my nasal passages if I were to blow on it to set it off.  Its characteristic aroma gives me an immediate "hit" of pleasant nostalgia associated with many hours of building models.

I read somewhere way back when, that using Accelerator improved the strength of CA, so I did some simple tests to see if it made a difference and found that it increases the adhesive quality of the bond, especially with metal parts...brass rod in particular as I wanted to use it to glue my investment cast N-scale switch stands together.  That plan went by the wayside when I bought my Resistance Soldering Station, which solved my sticking small brass parts together dilemma.

I had also heard that sticking bottles of it in the fridge or freezer extended its life greatly, but over the years I found that doing that was just inconvenient and didn't extend the life noticeably. Inserting a small Teflon tube into the applicator tip, then sealing it with an "L" shaped piece of brass or stainless wire stuck in the tube, seals up the bottle very well, and can be easily removed by just twisting the wire and pulling it out, to be re-used when I'm done.  I've got several bottles of both runny and thick CA that I've had for over five years that are still good which I never stored in my fridge/freezer.

On the other hand, I've also got several hardened, unopened bottles of CA that are only a year or so old, kept in exactly the same place as the opened-being-used bottles.   Why some of it lasts and some of it doesn't is a mystery.

To use Accelerator quickly, if I have several glue joints I need to make during model construction, I use a hairdryer set to medium heat, to evaporate the left-over Accelerator after the joint has cured, which totally deactivates any residual Accelerator...or just evaporates it all away, then glue and apply more Accelerator...let it cure then use the hairdryer again...and so on.  This works very well for me.

To make sure that the excess Accelerator has been eradicated, I just sniff the newly formed joint, and if I can still smell Accelerator odor, I apply more heated air until the odor goes away.

So, does Accelerator make CA glue joints stronger?  I think so, but I haven't used CA without Accelerator for decades and I handle my models carefully.  One thing for certain with my experience, is that I have NEVER noticed any weakening of glue joints caused by using Accelerator.

If I want a really strong joint, I use Epoxy, especially for sticking dissimilar materials together, such as Styrene to white metal, or brass mounting pegs for my caboose marker lamps that stick into plastic shells...parts that need to resist twisting.

Photo (1) - Using Epoxy to glue Styrene beams to a milled MTL Caboose underbody:


Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore