Author Topic: Limitless (if you’re within limits) locomotive energy  (Read 425 times)

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packers#1

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Limitless (if you’re within limits) locomotive energy
« on: May 26, 2022, 12:18:14 PM »
+2
Sawyer Berry
Clemson University graduate, c/o 2018

dem34

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Re: Limitless (if you’re within limits) locomotive energy
« Reply #1 on: May 26, 2022, 04:29:47 PM »
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Neat, same concept as old gravity cableways.
-Al

jagged ben

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nkalanaga

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Re: Limitless (if you’re within limits) locomotive energy
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2022, 02:16:00 AM »
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BNSF has been testing a battery locomotive to add to regular diesel-electric consists.  Instead of wasting the energy in dynamic brakes going downhill, or when stopping, they'd use it to charge the batteries.  Leave the yard with a charged battery, use the energy to accelerate the train, then recharge it while slowing down.

No, it won't eliminate the diesels, but it apparently does work well to save fuel, which itself is a big advance.
N Kalanaga
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John

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Re: Limitless (if you’re within limits) locomotive energy
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2022, 04:07:24 AM »
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My camry hybrid did that ...

packers#1

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Re: Limitless (if you’re within limits) locomotive energy
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2022, 08:44:04 AM »
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Here's a significantly more informative article about this:

https://www.trains.com/trn/news-reviews/news-wire/fmg-purchases-battery-electric-locomotives-from-progress-rail/

Thanks for the article, definitely way more info!
Sawyer Berry
Clemson University graduate, c/o 2018

peteski

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Re: Limitless (if you’re within limits) locomotive energy
« Reply #6 on: May 27, 2022, 11:59:38 AM »
+1
My camry hybrid did that ...

 And so do all hybrid automobiles, and I'm pretty sure fill-time electrics do that too.  Regenerative braking.
. . . 42 . . .

nickelplate759

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Re: Limitless (if you’re within limits) locomotive energy
« Reply #7 on: May 27, 2022, 12:14:12 PM »
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And so do all hybrid automobiles, and I'm pretty sure fill-time electrics do that too.  Regenerative braking.

Yes indeed.  I have indeed driven an electric car down a long hill and end up with a higher level of battery charge than I started with.
George
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I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that.

nkalanaga

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Re: Limitless (if you’re within limits) locomotive energy
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2022, 02:37:19 AM »
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You're right, that's all it is, is regenerative braking.  In the case of BNSF, the difference is that the "battery pack" is in a separate unit, rather than in the locomotive itself, so it can be used with any consist.

Electric locomotives have the advantage of unlimited regenerative capacity, as "the grid" can accept a lot more power than any battery, but there the electrical system has to be able handle current flow in both directions.  Many AC systems weren't designed to, and most 20th century AC/DC rectifier locomotives also didn't have regeneration abilities.  That would have required some kind of inverter.  The MILW and GN got around that with motor-generator designs, that were automatically bi-directional, but the PRR, as far as I know, never had a locomotive with regenerative braking.

N Kalanaga
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jagged ben

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Re: Limitless (if you’re within limits) locomotive energy
« Reply #9 on: May 28, 2022, 04:26:02 PM »
+1
You're right, that's all it is, is regenerative braking.  In the case of BNSF, the difference is that the "battery pack" is in a separate unit, rather than in the locomotive itself, so it can be used with any consist.


It appears the batteries are in the locomotive itself.  Unless they are trying more than one thing:
https://www.bnsf.com/news-media/news-releases/newsrelease.page?relId=bnsf-and-wabtec-commence-battery-electric-locomotive-pilot-test-in-california 

I was saying many years ago they should be doing this, adding battery tenders on mountain routes. This approach avoids the need to upgrade existing locomotives to receive battery energy from a separate unit.

jagged ben

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Re: Limitless (if you’re within limits) locomotive energy
« Reply #10 on: May 28, 2022, 04:43:24 PM »
+1
I was curious if I could find how much battery storage capacity the Wabtec loco has, and it turns out they have a youtube video that states is 2,400kWhs.
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That's pretty impressive in a package that size, I'm even a little incredulous.  (Must be NMC.)  Hope they didn't underengineer it from a safety standpoint. 

Anyway, it's theoretically about 45mins run time at a full 4,400 horsepower.  Well, probably 35-40mins after some efficiency factor and you probably don't want to draw the battery SOC below about 10%. 

nkalanaga

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Re: Limitless (if you’re within limits) locomotive energy
« Reply #11 on: May 29, 2022, 12:40:51 AM »
+1
The one I read about was supposed to be designed to be recharged from the diesel-electrics in the consist, as well as its own motors.  That way, the regular locomotives, given the wiring changes needed, would have regenerative braking, even though they didn't have their own batteries.
N Kalanaga
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