Author Topic: BLI PRR-P5A In Now  (Read 18852 times)

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squirrelhunter

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #45 on: February 17, 2022, 05:55:39 PM »
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See, I was think someone at the factory got overzealous about the blind driver idea and thought they could do one better by not having it touch the rail at all!

Chris333

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #46 on: February 17, 2022, 06:46:49 PM »
+1
The guy who designed the nano relief on the trucks and underframe simply passed the crack pipe to the man designing the center driver.

Lemosteam

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #47 on: February 17, 2022, 08:09:47 PM »
+1
And I was so excited about this model. Sigh.

Altoona

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #48 on: February 17, 2022, 09:06:20 PM »
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Question: How do you get the pantographs up?

Judd Barton



dem34

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #49 on: February 17, 2022, 10:21:52 PM »
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Got mine around 4 o'clock, Front driver does have a TT for some reason. Won't move more than a few mm on a piece of clean unitrak. Noticed that there is a philips head screw on each idler truck which may be what is intended for spring adjustment but it does not seem to have any effect on tension of the spring no matter the tightness. Both trucks are wired left and right with axle point pickups that are then wired to a screw attached to the split frame in front of each end's respective drivers.

At a loss on how pickup can be fixed with this without modification to the design. No keep alive means what little the thing gets can't be conserved, one of the drivers firmly mounted on the rails with the weight on it isn't picking up power due to the TT. Unless BLI has some sort of hacky fix I'll be returning mine within the week.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2022, 10:33:59 PM by dem34 »
-Al

bbussey

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #50 on: February 17, 2022, 11:06:05 PM »
+1
Question: How do you get the pantographs up?

Judd Barton

There's a pin in the center that holds the pants in place quite well.  I got mine free by sliding a screwdriver blade next to the pin and pushing up on the cross bracing.

Got mine around 4 o'clock, Front driver does have a TT for some reason. Won't move more than a few mm on a piece of clean unitrak. Noticed that there is a philips head screw on each idler truck which may be what is intended for spring adjustment but it does not seem to have any effect on tension of the spring no matter the tightness. Both trucks are wired left and right with axle point pickups that are then wired to a screw attached to the split frame in front of each end's respective drivers.

At a loss on how pickup can be fixed with this without modification to the design. No keep alive means what little the thing gets can't be conserved, one of the drivers firmly mounted on the rails with the weight on it isn't picking up power due to the TT. Unless BLI has some sort of hacky fix I'll be returning mine within the week.

Thanks for confirming that the traction tires are on the front drivers.  I haven't gone back to look at mine since being disgusted last night.

I think the pickup can be improved with the following modifications (which shouldn't be necessary to do at this price-point):
  • Swap out the flangeless center driver wheel/axle assemby with a replacement rear driver assembly which should put the tires on the rails along with flanges
  • Swap out the front driver wheel/axle assembly with another replacement rear driver assembly which removes the traction tire and increases pickup capability further
  • Either stretch the pilot springs to provide more pressure against the rails, or swap them out for Kato GG1 pilot springs
That should ... should ... turn all wheels into power conductors and eliminate the poor pickup.  The unit is heavy enough, so that isn't the problem.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2022, 11:16:00 PM by bbussey »
Bryan Busséy
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Ed Kapuscinski

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #51 on: February 17, 2022, 11:32:56 PM »
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This is all so incredibly disappointing.

peteski

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #52 on: February 17, 2022, 11:40:39 PM »
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How about giving the wheels a good cleaning?

 While I don't recall the specifics, some past run of some model had the drivers coated with some insulating coating (blackening or anti-rust agent which prevented good electrical pickup.  My own experience was with the Kato Freedom train GS4.  They used some other type of blacking than what they used on their regular GS4's and it was basically non-conductive. Only the tender was picking up power. Only after I totally stripped the blackening the loco started performing like a "Kato".

I know that the main problem here is due to the limited number of wheels picking up power, so any sort of a "muck" on the treads will make electrical pickup problem even worse.

I would use one of the Minitrix brass brush cleaner, then regular cleaning with alcohol. 
. . . 42 . . .

dem34

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #53 on: February 17, 2022, 11:53:42 PM »
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Could also attempt the bachmann route of having an aluminum tab spring mounted on top of the pilots. I'll try to clean any residue tomorrow. But still I ordered it from their direct store so I theoretically have no questions return available. I'm content with my HO one that is able to get around an entire room filling layout without any stalling. I am simply really disappointed since I wanted a few of these in N. More incentive to order some Graham Farish chassis and kitbash my own traction power a little more in line with my era.
-Al

bbussey

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #54 on: February 18, 2022, 12:12:27 AM »
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Conversely, the Mikado performance is outstanding.  As excellent as the P5a is poor.
Bryan Busséy
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NSE #1117
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Chris333

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #55 on: February 18, 2022, 12:24:15 AM »
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In the diagram it looks like the pilot pickups are just holes instead of Kato cones. Also the axle ends aren't pointed either.

squirrelhunter

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #56 on: February 18, 2022, 12:40:31 AM »
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Conversely, the Mikado performance is outstanding.  As excellent as the P5a is poor.

Yes, the new 2-8-2's run very well, better than the Paragon 3 run. There are several spots where my Paragon 3 mike stalls, but the Paragon 4 cruises right through on speed step 1.

The keep alives seem to be improved, but comparing the Paragon 4 (top) to the Paragon 3 (bottom), the tan cubes I think are the capacitors look to be the same size.


motofavorite

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #57 on: February 18, 2022, 01:50:01 AM »
+1
This is all so incredibly disappointing.

Agreed. Perhaps the P5a decoder includes a CV for catharsis.

nkalanaga

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #58 on: February 18, 2022, 02:12:40 AM »
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Bryan seems to have the best idea - replace the front and middle drivers with rear drivers.  If one wants the traction tires, for whatever reason, the front drivers could go in the midle, and a new rear set in the front.

Just as glad I didn't waste my money on one of these.  Sounds like getting the pans to reach my MILW wire height is the least of the problems!
N Kalanaga
Be well

peteski

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Re: BLI PRR-P5A In Now
« Reply #59 on: February 18, 2022, 03:22:48 AM »
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The keep alives seem to be improved, but comparing the Paragon 4 (top) to the Paragon 3 (bottom), the tan cubes I think are the capacitors look to be the same size.

Yes  the tan components are multi-layer ceramic capacitors. Depending on their physical size, they are likely 22 to 47 uF each. so the total capacitance would be in a range from 132-282 uF.  That's just my estimate. Those caps are non-polarized, and do not flame-out liek tantalum caps. 
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