Vintage N scale: Help to ID what this paint scheme might be...?

[learmoia]

I'm working on ID'ing cars from my Grandfathers N scale layout build in the mid 1980s, in an attempt to re-acquire as many items as I can... because I was stupid and sold most of the stuff in the early 2000s when I inherited it..

I have most of the stuff, but there are a few items I can't figure out what Roadname they are... 

He did custom paint / kitbash some stuff.. (as far as I can recall he only repainted stuff to New York Central)

This is a Roco mfg combo door steel boxcar.. I don't think it's custom painted.. but it could be.
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And this is a Lima 45' (I think Stock Car..), but it could be a boxcar or reefer..
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It's tough to tell, but I think it's a 3 letter car initial with orange or red lettering.. I can't find a Lima Black car with orange/red lettering on Trovestar

Thanks for the Help..

~Ian

[spookshow]

If it's any help, here's what's out there -





-Mark

[DKS]

Don't know if this is helpful, but here are "better" images--

[porkypine52]

Please post better images.  Still can't make out any detail.  Are these BRAIN SUCKER [cell phone] taken images?  I would like to advise on what the cars are, but need much clearer images.  A REAL DIGITAL camera can be picked up for cheap on Craigslist.  For any images I make a real camera can make a big difference.

[peteski]

Please post better images.  Still can't make out any detail.  Are these BRAIN SUCKER [cell phone] taken images?  I would like to advise on what the cars are, but need much clearer images.  A REAL DIGITAL camera can be picked up for cheap on Craigslist.  For any images I make a real camera can make a big difference.

I suspect that those images are extreme blow-ups of a scan of a (paper) photograph that likely shows the overall layout, and they are as good as they'll get.  That is probably all he has available.  That (and his memories) are probably all he has left of those cars.

[davefoxx]

Clearly, they used the camera technology often implemented in photographs of Bigfoot and UFOs. 

DFF

[learmoia]

I suspect that those images are extreme blow-ups of a scan of a (paper) photograph that likely shows the overall layout, and they are as good as they'll get.  That is probably all he has available.  That (and his memories) are probably all he has left of those cars.

Exactly...these photos are from the mid 1980s, early 1990 in basement.. 3x5 prints and some polaroid photos...

I'll post some of the 'full' photos tonight.. so you can see how far in I'm zooming... (I could try to get higher dpi scans)..

Part of me wishes I had not sold as much as I did... another part of me wishes I had documented it better when I decided to sell it....

I have the photos and a 10 minute (mostly out of focus) video.. along with some of his original drawings as he was designing it.

(i doubt the wayback machine or Worthpoint captured Ebay in the early 2000s)

~Ian

[thomasjmdavis]

(i doubt the wayback machine or Worthpoint captured Ebay in the early 2000s)

~Ian
[/quote]

According to the Wayback machine, they have been archiving eBay since 1997.  Now, of course, whether there is an existing archive for a particular page on a particular day....well....  But in a couple cases, I have found searches on Wayback to be useful- you might try searching for your own username cross referenced with "eBay" (?)- I have no idea if that would really work, but might be worth a try.

https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://ebay.com/

 I do hope you can find more info some way or other.  I wish I had more remembrances for my grandparents.

[learmoia]

This is a sample of the pictures I have to work with...

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Here is a video so you can see how it fits together.

I have gathered up most of the stuff over my years of vintage collecting, but there are a hand full of items I haven't been able to find.

I still think the Black Lima Stock car is a factory painted model.. (maybe Model Power)..

I'm starting to think the Combo Door Boxcar is custom.. 
I think the little yellow logo is part of a "Railway Express Agency" decal.

Either he took a black TPW car, painted out the logo and added the decal.. or painted the car a dark color and decal-ed it.

[peteski]

Wow! Nice!  That was quite a layout!  And sound equipped?  I could swear that I hear chuffing! Probably a sound generator attached to the throttle output?

[wazzou]

Please post better images.  Still can't make out any detail.  Are these BRAIN SUCKER [cell phone] taken images?  I would like to advise on what the cars are, but need much clearer images.  A REAL DIGITAL camera can be picked up for cheap on Craigslist.  For any images I make a real camera can make a big difference.

Retro, man.  Old images.

[learmoia]

Wow! Nice!  That was quite a layout!  And sound equipped?  I could swear that I hear chuffing! Probably a sound generator attached to the throttle output?

He dubbed the audio from a cassette tape or another video..

[thomasjmdavis]

@learmoia - You've probably thought of this already, but just in case.... When doing research, I have occasionally found that I get better results with old photos by putting them under a magnifier or low power microscope, than I do by scanning them and blowing them up digitally.  Especially when trying to read lettering or similar details. 

BTW- Where on earth did the buses shown on the left side of the 2nd photo come from?  One looks like a "fishbowl" bus of the early 60s (or the somewhat similar one that preceded it in the late 50s). I have a couple of resin buses that came from the 1990s, but don't recall anything much besides a Bachmann scenic cruiser and a school bus available in the 60s-70s.

And it sure looks like your Grandfather took full advantage of what appears to be a rather "rough" basement (reminds me of the original parts of my own 120 year old farmhouse basement)- it almost looks like parts of the right of way are carved right into the concrete in a couple of photos.

[learmoia]

@learmoia - You've probably thought of this already, but just in case.... When doing research, I have occasionally found that I get better results with old photos by putting them under a magnifier or low power microscope, than I do by scanning them and blowing them up digitally.  Especially when trying to read lettering or similar details. 

BTW- Where on earth did the buses shown on the left side of the 2nd photo come from?  One looks like a "fishbowl" bus of the early 60s (or the somewhat similar one that preceded it in the late 50s). I have a couple of resin buses that came from the 1990s, but don't recall anything much besides a Bachmann scenic cruiser and a school bus available in the 60s-70s.

And it sure looks like your Grandfather took full advantage of what appears to be a rather "rough" basement (reminds me of the original parts of my own 120 year old farmhouse basement)- it almost looks like parts of the right of way are carved right into the concrete in a couple of photos.

On your first point.. Hadn't really thought of it... but makes sense, it doesn't help that the prints are out of focus to begin with..

On your 3rd point.
Yes!... The term I heard was 'Michigan Basement' (eventhough the house was in Western New York)..
Either Stone or Block wall.. Dirt Floor.. Back half was dug out to about 7' headroom.. Front half was about chest high dirt. 

The layout 'benchwork' (so to speak) was homosote and dirt. 

I think he dug out a few paths to be able to walk to the two larger towns, but if you needed to work on something, you were hands and knees crawling on the dirt to get to it.

On the buses: I assume you mean the 2 tan ones? I'll look through my vintage catalogs.. I'm guessing they are Faller or something imported.

He wasn't afraid to mix in 'close enough to scale' stuff.. so they may not even be an N scale item.. could just be a kids toy of some sort.

[davefoxx]

Yes!... The term I heard was 'Michigan Basement' (eventhough the house was in Western New York)..
Either Stone or Block wall.. Dirt Floor.. Back half was dug out to about 7' headroom.. Front half was about chest high dirt. 

The layout 'benchwork' (so to speak) was homosote and dirt.

Good lord!  How was the humidity down there?!  Can't be good for the basement space or the house above. 

DFF