Archer Rivets

[dougnelson]

I used Archer rivets on my G25 car ends but these rivets seem much smaller and more closely spaced than the rivets on the Con-Cor gon.  It looks like the number of rivets is correct, but they may be somewhat oversized for N scale.  I looked at the other N scale rivets in Archer's catalog, but most seem too small and too closely spaced.  It does not seem to possible to match the Con-Cor rivets with Archer's N scale rivets.  What is other's experience?  Anyone using HO rivets?

[Chris333]

I could never get more than 3 Archer rivets to stay together in one piece so I bought the Mirco Mark set.

Sorry no help on the size issue.

[Angus Shops]

Archer has a number of different sets of ‘n scale’ rivets with various sized rivet heads and spacings (I think ‘pitch’ is the correct term). The smaller rivets are really small, but they are to scale. Many commercial models, likely including the Con Cor gon, have rivets that are substantially too large to represent  properly scaled rivets. This leaves a modeller with a choice to either add properly scaled rivets that won’t match those on the car, or add oversized rivets to match those on the car. There would be no problem with using products from any of their other scale products as long as you get the rivet size and spacing you need.

I’ve used Archer rivets for all of my heavyweight passenger car models and I typically use several different rivet sizes and spacings on the cars. Incidentally, I’ve never had a serious problem with the decal sheet falling apart, but I find a strip more than an inch or so long is difficult to rangle into place neatly. If a widely spaced rivet is required, I apply rivet pattern with closely spaced rivets, let it dry throughly and then pick of every second rivet with tip of my hobby knife.

I’ve got to say, the availability of Archer rivets has opened up a huge range of modelling opportunities for me; the heavyweights were not possible until then. I’ve never tried any of there other patterns, but I bet the louvers would be useful.
Geoff

[Cajonpassfan]

I too have had mixed results (meaning poor results) with application of Archer rivets. Is there a technique that works? Applying over primer, raw styrene, what? And how are the MicroMark rivets different! Neve tried those...
Suggestions welcome.
Thanks, Otto K.

[carlso]

Here is an image of a work in progress. This tender is one of Jason's castings and has Archer's applied. All of  the strips were applied in one piece.
Before applying them I sprayed a very light coat of white and then a coat of Crystal Clear. Once on and dried I sealed with some more (lightly) applied clear coat to protect the rivet heads. It would be relatively easy to knock some off while continuing work.





Be well,
Carl

[Angus Shops]

In most cases I’m applying rivets to a styrene ‘masters’ used to create molds for resin casting. I give the raw styrene a light rattle can coat of Testors gloss for good adhesion, apply the rivets and then seal with a rattle can coat of dull coat. The rivets stay on even when peeling off the cured RTV silicon mole material, even for multiple copies of the mold (mostly, might lose a few rivets, but easily fixed).

[SandyEggoJake]

Recently sat in on a virtual workshop presentation given by George Toman all about model rivets.... mostly for the HO guys, but did include some great prototype details and tips & best practices for using the Archer & Micromark details.  His opinion was the Archer were a bit finer in resolution and better QA/QC.... but Micromarks sheets are bigger and thus give much more dots per dollar than Archer.  (Alas, Micromark do not come in suitable N scale.)

His method was to apply the rivets as any waterslide decal, on a clean smooth surface, using Future / Pledge before to get a gloss and then after everything to seal.  Used a micro brush or spray entire side.
He suggested cutting the rivets strips as wide a possible to help keep them straight, and then use Micro Set to soften and Micro Sol to get rid of the film edge.   Also shared various tips, such as using Micro Sol to "melt" a row of rivets into a circle around say a boiler front. 

Those interested can find his slides in the File folder as "Using Archer, MicroMark and Harvested Rivets For Patterns and Models" .... but to get access, you may need to first sign up to become a member (free) of the https://groups.io/g/Hindsight2020

[mmagliaro]

I've used the Archer rivets quite a big on my steam models.  If the problem is that they are breaking apart...

Use ONLY water to get them off the sheet and position them.  Do NOT put Solvaset (or other setting solution) on them until you position them and let them dry.  Before I disciplined myself to put water on the model first, soak the decal in water until it released very easily, then slid it on and left it alone to fully dry before doing anything else, I broke the rivet decals quite a bit.

After they are DRY, then ONE swipe of a fine brush with Solvaset on it across the decal.  Don't swipe twice!  Once that dries I repeat several times with a swipe of Solvaset, letting it dry each time.  Until I did this, I would have trouble with them chipping off, moving around, pulling up at corners, etc.

Solvaset is strong, but I like it, undiluted.  You just have to be careful not to keep poking or brushing at the decal once you put it on.  One swipe and leave it alone.  With other decals, I put some water and a little Solvaset right on the model first, because it helps the decal slide into position and settle down well.  But the rivet decals are touchier.  Water only until they are dry, and then multiple one-swipe applications of setting solution.

[Angus Shops]

My experience exactly.

[dougnelson]

I will just note that among the HO RPM modelers a hot topic is harvesting of rivets.  They use Athearn blue box or other cheap donor cars and them remove rivets one by one for reuse.  Other, saner modelers, use Archers or similar. 

[wazzou]

I will just note that among the HO RPM modelers a hot topic is harvesting of rivets.  They use Athearn blue box or other cheap donor cars and them remove rivets one by one for reuse.  Other, saner modelers, use Archers or similar.

To me, that's both expensive and reminiscent of some form of torture.

[dem34]

I will just note that among the HO RPM modelers a hot topic is harvesting of rivets.  They use Athearn blue box or other cheap donor cars and them remove rivets one by one for reuse.  Other, saner modelers, use Archers or similar.

So.. Go incredibly out of your own way to expend massive amounts of time and effort to harvest something that in the end isn't even scale?

[MK]

Good for when you are doing a life imprisonment term.  You know, to whittle the time away.

[SkipGear]

My suggestion is to not soak them in water. I never float decals. I have a small plastic tray left over from McDonald's Pancakes. Place a doubled up paper towel in the tray and add enough water soak the entire paper towel and no more.

Lay decals on the wet paper towel, wait 2 minutes, check to make sure they slide then apply, wetting the area with Microset. Position and let dry, then come back with Microsol. Those two products used together are worlds better than solvaset. Solvaset is too harsh to be used as a wetting agent and not strong enough to melt the decal film. If you really need stronger than Microsol then look at Tamiya MarkFit strong or there is an Extra strong version due shortly.

[dougnelson]

After downloading rivet sheet images from the Archer website and then scaling them and printing, I think that I may try the HO scale starter set (AR88087) for a variety of rivet spacing that seems more in scale to what I am finding on N scale freight cars.  Like the G25 model at the start of this post, I am adding rivets to an existing model and need to at least come closer to the size and spacing.

Another option is the Micromark HO set.  It has 108 sq. inches in two sheets and big variety of rivet sizes and spacing, compared to the Archer at 12.4 sq. inches in a single sheet.  Both at the same price - $17.95.