Prototype Dirt Color

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Quick... what color is the dirt around Horseshoe Curve?

https://www.railpictures.net/photo/712868/

I bet you guessed wrong.

It's why I use my dirt grout color and why it's always worth working from photos when modeling scenery.

[dem34]

Pff Prototype photos, screw you I'm painting this beaded foam green. 

[DKS]

What part of the curve are you talking about? The dirt color varies depending on where you're standing...

https://www.railpictures.net/photo/709746/

https://www.railpictures.net/photo/705613/

https://www.railpictures.net/photo/664965/

https://www.railpictures.net/photo/529111/

https://www.railpictures.net/photo/65284/

"One photo does not a good reference make." ~Yoda

[C855B]

Yeah, I went around in little circles trying to come somewhere close to the soil colors in the little bit of scenery done so far. Biggest mental bias I had to get over was too dark and too brown, my mind's eye wanting mud, apparently. Proto photos fixed that - my proto photos, not something off the web that I can't verify hasn't been "adjusted" for better color rendering of, say, loco paint. This was underscored in my trying to match Spanish roof tiles here:



All of those test patches matched somebody's photo online. I chose mine, bottom right, knowing they weren't tweaked.

Not helping my soil matching was trying to use house paints off the mis-mixed shelf at the DIY store and thinking from memory that it was close... oh, so wrong!

[Dave V]

I just went to the prototype and retrieved the real thing. On my layout, the Placerville dirt came from Placerville, CO, the Rico dirt from Rico, Lizard Head from a half mile below the summit of Lizard Head Pass, and so on.  Free and correct scenery materials.

[Point353]

I just went to the prototype and retrieved the real thing. On my layout, the Placerville dirt came from Placerville, CO, the Rico dirt from Rico, Lizard Head from a half mile below the summit of Lizard Head Pass, and so on.  Free and correct scenery materials.

How did you scale them down to 1/87?

[Dave V]

How did you scale them down to 1/87?

First I spread it out on a foil-lined cookie sheet.  Then I run a magnet through it.  Then I bake it for 90-ish minutes.  I ended up sifting out at least 50% of the larger stuff.  What was left was a very fine powder that worked perfectly for HO scale.

[dem34]

What part of the curve are you talking about? The dirt color varies depending on where you're standing...


"One photo does not a good reference make." ~Yoda

Seems more like a nudge to remind people to add a bit of variety to their scenes. Lot of modelers keep their scenery fairly uniform even over large layouts.

[Philip H]

Go look up the Natural Resources Conservwtion a Service Soil Tables for the county or parish you model. Work from those to match colors. Free government data you can use!

[Hawghead]

I just went to the prototype and retrieved the real thing. On my layout, the Placerville dirt came from Placerville, CO, the Rico dirt from Rico, Lizard Head from a half mile below the summit of Lizard Head Pass, and so on.  Free and correct scenery materials.

I'm thinking Dr. Hotballs, RGS/D&RGW dirt digging service 

Scott

[Maletrain]

Trying to match real natural colors is difficult.  For me, it is almost impossible from memory.  So, I tend to try to get some real materials from the areas that I am modelling.  But, unlike Dave, I try to match paints to my samples of reality. 

For layout models, the added difficulty is that simply matching the actual color does not guarantee that it looks "right" in the artificial lights of various train rooms.  What we remember from the real world is how something looks in natural light, either direct sunlight or indirect light from a blue or gray (cloudy) sky.  Although the mind tends to try to adjust for tinted illumination, things often just don't look "right" under incandescent or florescent lights.  And, the various "color temperature" LED lights also can provide an "off" look, even the ones "rated" at 6500K, which is supposed to be "sunlight".  I notice that especially on human skin, but I suspect it shows up on other things, as well.  Probably the LED's "white" phosphors are missing some wavelengths or are more intense in some wavelengths  than the actual "black body" radiation spectrum from the sun.  And, when those not-quite-natural spectrums of "white" light hit various materials and the various wavelengths are reflect or absorbed, the result can depart even farther from what we see in real sunlight.  So, it seems that we need to model the light as well as the material to get the perfect "look". 

But, most people try to just mix paints in the lights the have in their train rooms (or clubs).  I have tried that, even matching paints to samples of the real materials under the lights in the train room.  I just don't seem to get very realistic looking results doing that under typical room lighting.

I am currently switching a bunch of old florescent fixtures to LED bulbs in our combination sewing/train room.  I bought 4 different "temperature" bulbs (2900K, 4200K, 5500K and 6500K) and installed them in the same fixture.  Although I can see that the bulbs look different when I look at the fixture, the resulting light spectrum looks really good when looking around the room.  There is enough blue to give sharp focus on small details, and enough warm colors to make the colors of items "pop" more than  what I see under just a 6500K bulb.  I like the look, and am going to try to use it for my modeling "atmosphere".

[Point353]

I just went to the prototype and retrieved the real thing. On my layout, the Placerville dirt came from Placerville, CO, the Rico dirt from Rico, Lizard Head from a half mile below the summit of Lizard Head Pass, and so on.  Free and correct scenery materials.

First I spread it out on a foil-lined cookie sheet.  Then I run a magnet through it.  Then I bake it for 90-ish minutes.  I ended up sifting out at least 50% of the larger stuff.  What was left was a very fine powder that worked perfectly for HO scale.

Evidently you feel it's worth the effort to go out and collect the "real thing" and then process it for use on the layout - plus you have access to that material relatively locally.
Is that because you get better results using natural earth as compared to manufactured scenery products?
Certainly it obviates the need to attempt color matching and no one can question the authenticity of your scenery. 

[DKS]

Seems more like a nudge to remind people to add a bit of variety to their scenes. Lot of modelers keep their scenery fairly uniform even over large layouts.

Exactly. I've got a half-dozen or more different colors of earth on my home property alone. And while it's always recommended--and commendable--to research the area you're modeling, it's also wise to look around and see what's going on in the surrounding area, rather than make assumptions. To paraphrase the OP, "I bet you [assumed] wrong."

[Tristan Ashcroft]

Quick... what color is the dirt around Horseshoe Curve?

So here's the thing. 
         That's not dirt, and that's not the Horseshoe Curve.  That's rock at Benny, and the difference between the Curve and Benny matters.  Dirt typically takes it's original color from the underlying bedrock, then various weathering processes - biologic and other - and people add the rest.  Weathering can give you the leached yellows here in the north, deep red weathered colors in the south, and deep, rich organic soil is black.  Anything between Altoona and Gallitzen probably has several feet of cinders in drifts from 100 years of steam locomotives working their guts out - on top before even getting down to soil.  (this is also why all your late PRR, Penn Central, and early to mid-CR retaining walls are black) 
         Anyway, the picture of Benny you linked to is underlain by the either the Pennsylvanian Allegheny group or the Pennsylvanian Pottstown group.  Hence the grey to yellow/buff family of colors.  Down at the Curve, the railroad is underlain by the Devonian Catskill Formation (and/or a couple of it's various members - Duncannon or Sherman Creek), and the big cut in the apex of the Curve is lowermost Mississippian-Devonian Rockwell Formation.  The Catskill is broadly red with some variability, and the Rockwell is more light colored (a white/grey color) unit that can be buff.
         Not sure I understand how attachments work.  If I do, I've attached a screen cap of some rock units from Altoona to Cresson.

[ Guests cannot view attachments ]

[Dave V]

Great to hear from another earth scientist!  Now that's how you do model railroading the Railwire way!