Help with Milw Coal Gondola Identification

[Bryn]

I'm after some help trying to find more detailed photographs and prototype information on the gondolas in the links below.

I hope to try model this working in N Scale and at a first glance some repainted Athearn Thrall gondolas might be good starting point.


https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4209/34475620203_44944d1eaa_k.jpg

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4218/34441717074_8f76b2fbbc_k.jpg

Images found on;

http://www.railphoto-art.org/collections/bjorklund/milwaukee-road-west/#!jig[1]/https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4283/34475720943_879a3ba48b_k.jpg

Thanks in advance!

[Ed Kapuscinski]

They may not be perfect matches, but I think the Athearn (previously MDC) cars are the perfect answer.

[cv_acr]

Yeah those are Thrall cars like the Athearn/MDC gons.

[Bryn]

Thanks for the quick responses guys!

Does anyone recognise the paint scheme and details I would need to decal one up?

[Ed Kapuscinski]

I actually just saw this video last night with cars that looked AWFULLY similar.

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Could they be?

[Bryn]

Great find, thanks for passing it on Ed. It's certainly the same style livery, I'll do some more digging.

Edit - http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2778001 I also found the cars from your link Ed.

[Bryn]

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1318788

After some research I’m pretty certain this the cars were operated in the WISX (Wisconsin Power and Light) pool, which at a glance are very similar to the Athearn model.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Great find, thanks for passing it on Ed. It's certainly the same style livery, I'll do some more digging.

Edit - http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2778001 I also found the cars from your link Ed.

Awesome!
Glad I was helpful.

[milw156]

Pretty sure your photo is of the Big stone power coal train (BSPX) which I believe originated and terminated on the Milwaukee between Montana and South  Dakota. The WISX trains, ( trains 286.  & 287) originated on the BN in the PRB, and were turned over to the Milw at Council Bluffs, and ititially traveled to Savanna Il, then up the "Southwestern" through South Beloit and into Milwaukee and filly Portage. Trains ran via this routing from January 1978 until June 1978 when the 112 pound rail the line was built with busted and derailed several cars into an opposing train wating fort it to pass. After that, WISX was routed Savanna-Chicago-Milwaukee  and finally Portage. (From Jerry Pyfer's book "Milwaukee Road, Tales of the Southwester" that came out this past summer. Jerry was some good pics showing black cars with yellow ends. Trains usually rated 5-6 SD 40-2's or equivalent U30 c's. Some BN, some Milw, and not unusual to have a leased Souther SD 24 or two due to the power shortages the Milwaukee was experiencing. One picture of an NP caboose restenciled for BN on the back of one. Sometime in early 80' train was rerouted thru Montana( I am ASSuming still on the BN?)-Minnesota and to LA Crosse before reaching Portage from the north. They we're in fact Thrall 100 ton cars, don't think they were ever offered in the WISX scheme, though should be easy enough to get decals made (Circus City decals might be a good place to start ). Sorry for being late to the party. Strongly recommend Jerry's book if you are a Milwaukee fan!
Rick

[Bryn]

Thanks Rick,

Funnily enough, I recently picked up a copy of Jerry's book here in the UK from a local importer. I think you're right about the BSPX train, the Milw caboose rather than BN could be a factor?

I've recently picked up a pair of BN SD40-2s, now it's the not so simple mater of finding a long rake of Thralls!

[Missaberoad]

The Otter Tail Power Co. (Bigstone) cars were quite different from the cars in the OP.  They were brown and white and had distinctive covers.

http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/misc-frt/bspx270o20.jpg

In addition the cabooses used were specially modified for that service.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=5159077

The train in the original post is definitely a Powder River train. The EV cabooses were ordered to BN specs for coal service and were pooled with BN cabooses. (much like the Milwaukee U30Cs.)

I'll see what I can dig up in my library...

[Ike the BN Freak]

Great find, thanks for passing it on Ed. It's certainly the same style livery, I'll do some more digging.

Edit - http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=2778001 I also found the cars from your link Ed.

This one looks like the PS4000s that Fox Valley has done.

https://shopfvm.com/collections/n-rolling-stock/products/n-ps-coal-gondola-6-pack-cepx

[milw156]

Thanks Rick,

Funnily enough, I recently picked up a copy of Jerry's book here in the UK from a local importer. I think you're right about the BSPX train, the Milw caboose rather than BN could be a factor?

I've recently picked up a pair of BN SD40-2s, now it's the not so simple mater of finding a long rake of Thralls!

Missaberoad jogged my memory and maybe I am misreading the reporting marks on the cars in those pictures. there are a nimber of pics of the BSPX trains in that same reference you found these pics in.  The info states it was taken in 1980, which means it could very well have originated in Montana, most likely Colstrip south of the transcon at Forsythe Mt(remember reading that somewhwere). There does not seam to be a connection north from the PRB to the Milwaukee that would explain the BN connection that existed prior to 1980 where the train were handed over to the Milw at Omaha/CB (think out of the box that all coal in the west is from PRB!!!) So, depending on the year you want to model, you could have a train with all Milw power(after 1980) or a mix of BN, Milw, with or without any Southern/PNC, B&O or CN leased units, with a Milwaukee OR a BN extended vision caboose if it was before 1980. Think about the possibilities of having Bicentennial units from both RR's in the same coal train! Since I am planning on modeling 1976, this led me to acquire both the Milw 156 and the BN  Bicentennial U30-C (1776?) Need to get a BN extended vision caboose now.
Of the correct Athearn Thrall cars, it would seem that the KCPL and CWEX cars would be easiest to modify by painting the ends yellow and changing reporting marks and numbers to WISX. Or, if you want to take an easier way out, get the Wisconsin Electric cars (WEPX)and use as is. Different Public service Commission in same state (tho served by CNW) Or contact Athearn to make the WISX cars in future release.
Met Jerry at a slide show he gave at the Janesville (Wi) public library this past January where he mentioned the book was coming out. Nice guy with some great stories, some of which are in the book, which make it a much more informative read than "nothing but the facts" type books. It is the only book about the Milwaukee that I have read that listed the industries along a subdivision, the inbound and outbound loads, AND what RR's cars were most often seen there. It would be worth twice the cost just for that info alone!

[Missaberoad]

BN interchanged coal trains with Milwaukee at Miles City, MT pre 1980.
In fact the reason why the Pacific Extension was cut off there was for Powder River coal trains, BNSF still leases the former Milwaukee Row from the state of South Dakota.

[Missaberoad]

I dug out my copy of Fred Hyde's book and bingo!

On page 86/87 there is a couple photos in Montana of the exact cars in the OP.

The caption says they are train 280/281 for Columbia, WI. Edit: Columbia Power near Portage Wisconsin, see @milw156's post below...
Which would be Wisconsin Power and Light. BN and Milwaukee shared the train east of Miles City, alternating routes...

A bit more digging turned up this forum thread which confirms the WISX reporting marks on the cars and has a number of interesting story's about the Milw/BN Powder River operations...

http://railroad.net/viewtopic.php?f=81&t=64971


As an aside I highly recommend getting copies of Fred's two Milwaukee road books... They fetch a high price but are two of the finist books on the road. Fred was a Milwaukee employee and very knowledgeable.