Pfauder steel milk car question

[sirenwerks]

Does anyone know what the tobing is above the coupler in this shot? I see from other pics that, in its original state, these were usually plated over with a single piece of steel.

[Chris333]

Buffer for running with passenger equipment. Part of it is missing in your photo.

[nkalanaga]

Buffer for passenger service.  There would be springs in the tubes, and the "plate" would match the bottom of the passenger car's diaphragm.  I don't know why they used them, but have seen them on other passenger-service cars without diaphragms.

Looks like Chris333 posted at the same time I tried to...

[peteski]

The Athearn N scale Pfaulder Milk car has that detail modeled on it.

[sirenwerks]

I was under the impression buffers were not used in N America. Are there examples of other passenger equipment that used buffers?

[Chris333]

All milk car I've seen have the buffers. The butter dish car, the flats with 2 milk tank trailers. All have buffers right above the coupler. I think the idea was to cushion the ride for passengers.

http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/non-nyc/images/bfix-516.jpg

http://users.rcn.com/jimdu4/MilkTrains/NX_1487.htm

[CNR5529]

I was under the impression buffers were not used in N America. Are there examples of other passenger equipment that used buffers?

Most, if not all, passenger cars have a buffer system built into the diaphragm/gangway. Even modern cars today are very similar in concept to what we see on those milk cars. They are just out of view most of the time, hidden behind/under the diaphragm.

[thomasjmdavis]

L&N had several in MOW service in the 1960s.  Not sure how long they lasted. 
http://rr-fallenflags.org/ln/ln40603ags.jpg

Buffer was chopped and steam lines and such removed.

[nkalanaga]

Sirenwerks:  These aren't "buffers" in the European sense.  Those are an integral part of the coupling system, taking all of the force when pushing, or braking, a train.

The American passenger buffers basically are a solid floor for the diaphragm, ensuring there is no gap between the two cars.  They're built into the diaphragm in cars with them, but are also included on cars, and some locos, that can be coupled to diaphragm-equipped cars.  They serve no purpose in coupling or train handling.  All "buffing" forces are carried by the coupler and draft gear.

[sirenwerks]

Sirenwerks:  These aren't "buffers" in the European sense.  Those are an integral part of the coupling system, taking all of the force when pushing, or braking, a train.

The American passenger buffers basically are a solid floor for the diaphragm, ensuring there is no gap between the two cars.  They're built into the diaphragm in cars with them, but are also included on cars, and some locos, that can be coupled to diaphragm-equipped cars.  They serve no purpose in coupling or train handling.  All "buffing" forces are carried by the coupler and draft gear.

So they're more like frame extensions, than buffers in the Euro sense?

[nkalanaga]

They're not even "frame extensions", really, just a diaphragm without the sides and top.  Those tubes don't serve any function except to hold the springs and keep the buffer from moving sideways or vertically.  Just like a North American passenger car, the car would work fine without the diaphragm or buffer, as long as no one tried to walk from one car to the next.

You can couple a standard freight car to a diaphragm-equipped car with no problems, and everything will work fine, so I don't know why the buffers were used on milk and express cars.  And, since most American passenger trains didn't have a special observation car, the last car's diaphragm wasn't restrained by anything, so it couldn't have been needed to keep the adjacent car's diaphragm compressed.  I have no idea what it was for.

[peteski]

I was under the impression buffers were not used in N America. Are there examples of other passenger equipment that used buffers?

I wonder if you are thinking of the European-style buffers.



These buffers are larger and spread out to the edges of the cars. These are integral part of the coupling systems used in Europe. They keep the coupling link under tension. US knuckle-style couplers do not need those buffers. I suspect that the passenger buffers we are taking about here are used to stretch the couplers in between coupled cars to minimize the 1:1 slinky effect. 

[nkalanaga]

That's an odd-looking arrangement.  Are those British wagons with an aftermarket European screw-link?

[StarCruiser]

And people wonder why European trains seem so small compared to North American trains...?

There's no way that coupling system can handle anywhere near the load that ours can!

[peteski]

That's an odd-looking arrangement.  Are those British wagons with an aftermarket European screw-link?

Not sure - I was mainly interested in the buffers (since that was being discussed).  They might be older British couplings.  Here is a more modern European coupling arrangement:



Not all that different.