Mystery car on Amtrak North Coast Hiawatha 1974

[sirenwerks]

Watching the second part of the 30th installation of the Harris films on YouTube (https://youtu.be/Bb0UjkQZ87Q) which mostly shows scenes of the 1974 North Coast Hiawatha in Montana, going both directions. The train featured at about 10:22 shows an end car that is painted in a curious paint scheme and it looks like it's articulated. The paint job on the car looks kinda like LIRR with blue MTA logos (in my head) and I didn't think Amtrak got any of SP's articulated coaches. Any input on a) what the paint scheme is and b) if my mind is playing tricks on me with the articulated thing?

Here's a screen shot; the image is not the most in focus for its time - apparently Harris had a hinky auto-focus, auto-exposure 16 mm:




BTW, anyone interested in early 70s western railroading should check out the Harris films. They're generally short watches, sometimes not lit the best, and the music that cuts in instead of the dubbed diesel sounds can sometimes be annoying, but some good action caught by the original filmmaker.

Thanks,

Bryan

[wcfn100]

The TN&O had articulated coaches that looked very similar and Amtrak did have articulated coaches, at least in the diagram book.

http://trainz.jbartus.com/docs/NRPC_CMO-117/pdf/501_Amtrak_NRPC_CMO-117.pdf

http://s4.zetaboards.com/amtkz/topic/9743474/1/

edit:  Here's one in Amtrak.  FYI, this is the bathroom side that has three windows on each car towards the middle.  The other side has just two windows.



The other side.



Jason

[wcfn100]

Scroll about halfway down on this page, there's a bunch of photos.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/mbernero/sets/72157660532470228/with/23866638851/

Jason

[nkalanaga]

Jason:  Between an NP and a GN car, I wouldn't be surprised if that first picture was on the North Coast Hiawatha.  The Empire Builder usually didn't get the really odd stuff, at least that I saw in Pasco, but the NCH went through Wenatchee, so I didn't see it.

1974 was also the World's Fair in Spokane, and Amtrak leased extra cars for both the Empire Builder and North Coast Hiawatha, as well as running an extra Seattle-Spokane day train that summer.  There's no telling WHAT might have appeared that year.

The eastbound Empire Builder ran in two sections at least once.  I saw it, at the Pasco station, and between the two sections it had twenty-some cars.  I don't remember the exact number, but somewhere in the mid twenties.  The first section had SDP40Fs, and the second F units, which were seldom seen after the new units entered service.  That's the only time I ever saw a train with green class lights.  I suspect that the second section was Seattle to Spokane only, but didn't have any way of knowing.

[sirenwerks]

OK, so those blue signs under the windows look like the treatment on those under-the-window Amtrak signs, but what's up with the two-tone gray paint scheme? The train in the video was on long enough and the angle changed enough to show this was a two-grey scheme and not some trick of the light, making for odd refection that made the car body sides look a darker gray than the ends, side door areas, and roof.

[Chris333]

Maybe part stainless panels and part silverish paint so when the light hits it looks 2 tone?

[sirenwerks]

Scroll about halfway down on this page, there's a bunch of photos.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/mbernero/sets/72157660532470228/with/23866638851/

Jason

Winner, winner, chicken dinner! Chris was right about the two metal treatments. Mystery solved.


Gotta model this set. I like the Ph 1 Amtrak SDPs and Fs but I don't like Amtrak Ph 1 rolling stock. No offense to Old Glory, but I just don't think Ph 1 red, white and blue looks good on a rail car (in fact, none before Ph 4. This car set, along with the odd others that have the same scheme, gives the chance of having early Amtrak train with some AMTK-lettered equipment without the patriotic skunk look. Of course, there'll be a much heavier presence of CZ, ATSF, NP, GN, UP, and SP cars.

[Mark5]

No offense to Old Glory, but I just don't think Ph 1 red, white and blue looks good on a rail car (in fact, none before Ph 4. <snip>

Phase one is my fave.  Taster's choice.

Mark

[sirenwerks]

Phase one is my fave.  Taster's choice.

Mark

To me, Phase 1 took rail travel from respectable and classy, even, to McDonald's in one fell swoop. Then again, I guess the Golden Arches was respectable at one point.

[Mark5]

To me, Phase 1 took rail travel from respectable and classy, even, to McDonald's in one fell swoop. Then again, I guess the Golden Arches was respectable at one point.

Gettin harsh there ...

Heh, by 1971, which railroads had respectable and classy passenger trains? (not many)

1970s was the era of bold schemes in many areas (not just railroads) - I kinda like that.

https://history.amtrak.com/archives/coast-starlight-led-by-e9a-locomotive-no.-418-1970s

[peteski]

My favorite is Ph III (even width stripes). It looks very patriotic on stainless steel cars (and reminds me of the older American Airlines livery which I also liked).

[nkalanaga]

For me it's Phase I or no Amtrak, as that's all they had in 1974.  But they still had some of the older schemes, so I can run just about anything.

Among the roads that still had respectable passenger trains in 1971 was the BN.  Both the GN and NP were still running two main trains each way, although I'm not sure what the CB&Q had, outside the Chicago-Twin Cities route.  Both the Empire Builder and North Coast Limited were still good trains, clean, well maintained, and well operated.  The Western Star and Mainstreeter were typical secondary, "all stops" trains, but were still run with some pride.  The BN kept running them until Amtrak took over.

It wasn't that the GN or NP wanted to run passenger trains, but management, and they shared much of their management, felt that if they HAD to run them, they were at least going to show a good face to the public.  Especially across Montana and North Dakota, roads weren't the best, and the passenger train was still a popular way to travel.  Even today the Empire Builder carries a surprising number of short-haul passengers through there, and both states would love to have the North Coast Hiawatha back.

[sirenwerks]

Gettin harsh there ...

Heh, by 1971, which railroads had respectable and classy passenger trains? (not many)

1970s was the era of bold schemes in many areas (not just railroads) - I kinda like that.

https://history.amtrak.com/archives/coast-starlight-led-by-e9a-locomotive-no.-418-1970s

It looks fine when it's washed but that was only for press like this image. And consider the interiors are the same level of ratty as the other passenger trains you just dissed. So the motto "Still the same crappy interiors you're used to, with a grimy homogenous wrapper on the outside. Yawn.

[Mark5]

It looks fine when it's washed but that was only for press like this image. And consider the interiors are the same level of ratty as the other passenger trains you just dissed. So the motto "Still the same crappy interiors you're used to, with a grimy homogenous wrapper on the outside. Yawn.

The Amtrak trains I rode (1975/1976) were nice - inside and out. YMMV.

The trains I "dissed" was a joke  ... TBH the other trains I rode in the 1960s/70s (N&W and SOUTHERN) were nice too.

[nkalanaga]

The ones I rode in 1973, the EB and Broadway Limited, were also quite nice.  Can't say much for the ham and cheese sandwich in the snack bar on the Empire Builder, but I suspect that was as much my stomach as the sandwich.  The train was making up time through eastern Montana, and the ride in the ex-ATSF coach got a little rough in places.  It was much better in the ex-GN Great Dome Lounge, even up in the dome.

The rough ride was mostly due to uneven track, after the winter freeze and thaw.  The railroad was working on it, but whenever the train wasn't under a slow order, the crew did their best to get back on schedule.  We arrived in Chicago, from Pasco, only a few minutes late.