Next run of Atlas GP38-2 will be sound equipped

[conrail98]

So I guess the question I have is is this a new mechanism for the sound and sound ready? If not, does this mean we might see, like the other boards, ESU boards for previously released versions that are DCC ready or is this board some other that is already available that I missed?

Phil

[basementcalling]

So I guess the question I have is is this a new mechanism for the sound and sound ready? If not, does this mean we might see, like the other boards, ESU boards for previously released versions that are DCC ready or is this board some other that is already available that I missed?

Phil

Safe assumption that as long as sound commands a premium of $90-100 more than a non sound equipped loco that manufacturers will feed that market.

[wmcbride]

I hope/wish Atlas had some input from John Colombo about speakers. As he noted in several threads, the sound/speaker could be improved over what Intermountain offered.

[jdcolombo]

I hope/wish Atlas had some input from John Colombo about speakers. As he noted in several threads, the sound/speaker could be improved over what Intermountain offered.

Well, no, they didn't, but everything I've done (including my IM SD40-2 upgrade) is "public record," so they don't need to hire me as a consultant (sadly ).  I suspect that this offering will use either the board designed for the IM SD40-2 or the "retrofit" board.  Either way, it means that the speaker probably will have to be in the fuel tank area, which is fine IF they design the enclosure so that there is enough free air space and make it air-tight.  IM's speaker enclosure wasn't big enough and wasn't completely air-tight.  I understand the engineering challenge: ideally, you need to design a speaker enclosure to house the speaker that's bigger than the speaker itself, be completely sealed, and yet have terminals on the outside of the enclosure that don't require a soldering job for installation.   I'm not sure it's possible do this in a cost-effective way.  Thankfully, the NKP didn't have any GP38's, although I'll probably end up buying one of these just to tear it apart and see what could be improved, like I did with the IM SD40 (and I can run these at Ntrack shows, so there's that).   

I'm really not wild about the move to a full-length board that requires a fuel-tank speaker install.  Retrofitting a speaker to a fuel tank is not a trivial matter, requiring a significant amount of milling.   But perhaps the milling saved by using a standard board makes the milling part a wash.  The real difficulty is going to be designing a speaker enclosure that gets the internal air volume correct but still fits in the available space.  It's going to have to be thin and wide/long, rather than a conventional box around the speaker edges.  And there won't be much fuel tank left when it's done, if it is done correctly.

In my view, the Zimo MX649 is the perfect footprint for a sound decoder: 9mm wide by 23mm long by 4mm thick.  This footprint allows you to put the decoder at one end of the chassis, the speaker at the other, and the 9mm width fits easily inside a hood diesel shell.  Unfortunately, Zimo doesn't have the sound file library that ESU does, and some of the decisions they've made implementing things like the horn and bell have been a bit weird (although their EMD 567 V16 file is now excellent).   Most of this is a moot point for me, though - I've just got one more sound install to do for my diesel fleet, and then everything I use on the layout will have been converted.  All I really need now is for Matt Hermann to finish the new steam sound files (well, and record NKP 765!).

John C.

[ryan_wilkerson]

Thanks for the quick update Paul. So there will still be the existing DC lightboard and now a new ESU board that supports sound?

There is a cut and paste error on our part.  The feature set should match the C628/630 announcement from March.  We are working on updating the information.  There is no 6 or 8 pin plug.

[coosvalley]

Another, non sound related downside of putting a speaker in the fuel tank in the GP38-2 is that the 3000 gal. fuel tank is generally incorrect for many GP38-2s anyway. I was hoping they'd find a way to fix this in future offerings, not find a continued need to keep using the overly large fuel tank

[peteski]

Another, non sound related downside of putting a speaker in the fuel tank in the GP38-2 is that the 3000 gal. fuel tank is generally incorrect for many GP38-2s anyway. I was hoping they'd find a way to fix this in future offerings, not find a continued need to keep using the overly large fuel tank

You know, moving to H0 scale would alleviate *ALL* of these problems. 

[coosvalley]

You know, moving to H0 scale would alleviate *ALL* of these problems. 

Continue the exodus!!

I would rather see if I can cram a Atlas Scale speed motor into the Walthers /Proto frame, which DOES com with the shorter version or the larger version, depending on prototype, you know, like it should be!

I have been modeling in HO the whole time I've been modeling in N scale too, and I have a HOn30 layout as well....I don't ever leave a scale, I just pick up new ones...

[jdcolombo]

You know, moving to H0 scale would alleviate *ALL* of these problems. 

Well, not exactly.  I've done a number of HO sound installs in older Atlas and Bowser/Stuart diesels for a club member, and there are engineering challenges in the bigger scale, too.  For example, I could use the ESU Select Direct replacement board (which then uses the LokSound micro as the "brains" of the operation), but then there is no place to put a big (e.g., TCS KA1 or KA3) keep alive.  And to fit a speaker, means milling a space in the big honkin' weight that Atlas uses, then rerouting a couple of truck pickup wires and LED placement for whichever weight got milled.   So I end up using an .040 styrene "shelf" where the old board was; an ESU Select Micro as the decoder, a TCS KA3 as the keep alive, and a 13x18mm speaker in a custom enclosure sitting in the milled-out weight.  It takes just about as long to do one of the HO locos as it does one of my GP9's or RS11's. 

Here's a photo of an install in an HO scale Stewart Alco C-628 diesel:

[ Guests cannot view attachments ]

Admittedly, though, making new HO locos sound equipped is easier . . . although the manufacturers still haven't read up on basic loudspeaker design, because the factory-equipped speakers are just as lousy in HO scale as they are in N scale.  Sooner or later, somebody will figure all this out from a manufacturing perspective.  Until then, my HO-scale sound installs just annihilate factory sound in everything I've done in that scale (even if I do say so myself  ).   So . . . HO may provide some space advantages, but until someone actually takes advantage of all that space in a productive way, it isn't any better, and retrofitting really isn't any easier.  The simple fact is that today, if you want the best sound available, you're on your own, whether it is HO scale or N scale.  (I have a friend with some LGB stuff, though, that sounds REALLY good!).

John C.

[peteski]

Continue the exodus!!

I would rather see if I can cram a Atlas Scale speed motor into the Walthers /Proto frame, which DOES com with the shorter version or the larger version, depending on prototype, you know, like it should be!

I have been modeling in HO the whole time I've been modeling in N scale too, and I have a HOn30 layout as well....I don't ever leave a scale, I just pick up new ones...

I'm with you - I actually enjoy tackling the challenges of N scale.  There is also nothing wrong with being a multi-scaler.  More fun that way!

[mrnhn]

Doe's anyone know if the sound chassie is the same as the older engines so you could do a shell swap Wendell

[coosvalley]

I doubt they would re-tool the shell if it could be avoided. But the folks at Atlas have not said a word (conspicuously quiet actually!)about how they are fitting a speaker into either this loco or the C628s...

[mrnhn]

I have four New Hampshire Northcoast GP38-2 that want sound for That why I asked about the shell swap. I would buy B&M engines and do the swap and then the sell the B&M engines

[Joetrain59]

Non sound comment. I hope Atlas will do LIRR blue/yellow/black, as LL already did the blue wave scheme. Oh, and N.Y.& A., too. Yes, the fuel tanks would be too big.
 Joe D

[wazzou]

I doubt they would re-tool the shell if it could be avoided. But the folks at Atlas have not said a word (conspicuously quiet actually!)about how they are fitting a speaker into either this loco or the C628s...

The C628's were already notoriously crappy pullers, I can't imagine trying to drag around 10 cars just to hear it sound as though it were trying to pull 10X that number.