Author Topic: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car  (Read 2929 times)

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Lemosteam

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PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« on: April 21, 2016, 12:16:15 PM »
+6
I finally got my etchings done and built the PRR B74b class horse car from the Micro-Trains version.  The PRR had a unique end door and side door windows from the MT model.

 I have been testing the new Shapeways material with the proper PRR roof design, hence the multi color patches. A new pristine roof is due next week for the finished car so I designed overlays for them. 

The end door requires shaving the upper roof frame and raised details away and extending the doorway recess all the way up. 

The Pennsylvania lettering I am told is all wrong so I will try the lettering removal technique and re decal.

The side doors just glue in place over the current doors after snipping out the original window separators. After paint I will use clear plastic for the glass.  I suppose one could shave or mill more material away to have more relief, but this is the first test of the design.
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The end door is made up of ten pieces: a center door, the main rear door and eight hinges. All existing details are shaved away using an exacto chisel blade.  The roof frame must be shaved away flush to the back wall. Extending the existing doorway recess allows the center door to be glued in place.  The main back wall doors are installed next centering on the center door and against the lower sill. The hinges can be installed before or after the main back wall is installed, but it may be beneficial to do this first so the edge can be dragged lightly along a file to ensure that the etch tags are gone.
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Here is a shot of the new roof overhang.
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Here is a shot of the whole car.  Still need to determine the proper trucks, but it may be the same as those under the MT PRR Diner car.
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What do you think @jmlaboda ?


towl1996

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2016, 01:40:14 PM »
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Never argue with idiots; they'll drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience.

chicken45

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2016, 02:37:36 PM »
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It's a quick and dirty mod that makes it "good enough" for a pass. Can't wait!
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Cajonpassfan

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2016, 02:50:45 PM »
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Very cool, and the MT trucks just may work.
My only question is the shallowness of the doors; heavyweights of the era had pretty thick sides. That's something that's bothering me about the MT headend cars anyway, and adding an overlay just accentuates the shallow look. My 2 cents...
Otherwise, very cool.
Otto K.

Dave V

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #4 on: April 21, 2016, 02:57:53 PM »
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John,

Awesomeness as always!

Now that we have two horse cars to choose from, you may want to see what it'd take to make the WoT horse car more Pennsy-fied.

That said I'm left a bit confused by all the hub-bub around the horse cars.  They weren't nearly as common on head-ends of Pennsy trains to the extent that express X29s and R50bs were.  Awesome that we can now approximate them in N, but these are on my "too rare to care" list.  YMMV.
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Lemosteam

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #5 on: April 21, 2016, 03:39:06 PM »
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Very cool, and the MT trucks just may work.
My only question is the shallowness of the doors; heavyweights of the era had pretty thick sides. That's something that's bothering me about the MT headend cars anyway, and adding an overlay just accentuates the shallow look. My 2 cents...
Otherwise, very cool.
Otto K.

@Cajonpassfan , I see your point, and one could continue to shave away material from the opening to lower them in the recess further but you run the risk of damaging the sides top and bottom of the opening.  This is about as thin as I can have etches made without having them turn into aluminum foil.

Lemosteam

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #6 on: April 21, 2016, 03:42:43 PM »
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John,

Awesomeness as always!

Now that we have two horse cars to choose from, you may want to see what it'd take to make the WoT horse car more Pennsy-fied.

That said I'm left a bit confused by all the hub-bub around the horse cars.  They weren't nearly as common on head-ends of Pennsy trains to the extent that express X29s and R50bs were.  Awesome that we can now approximate them in N, but these are on my "too rare to care" list.  YMMV.

@Powdered Toast Man yeah, i get it.  For some it is that uniqueness that makes them want one, right @chicken45 ?  For others that model the south, horse racing was a big deal and the PRR hauled the prized horses all over for nearly all of the big races.

Only reason I chose the B74b, was because the B74a isn't even close as an MT starting point.


cgw

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2016, 04:07:08 PM »
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So John;   When are you going to sell a mod kit with all the goodies for the rest of us SPF's to roll our own B74B's.   I got get that Pennsy fix you know it highly addicting................. :P

jmlaboda

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2016, 04:53:47 PM »
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Quote
What do you think @jmlaboda ?

Nice!!!

It is closer to what a PRR car would be like and I do like the look... do hope folks will consider what you have done and choose to do the same, even though the car could still use some further changes it is never the less a nice looking model.

Quote
Only reason I chose the B74b, was because the B74a isn't even close as an MT starting point.

I wonder if a person could use the M&R Espee 70-BH-3 horse car sides (or for that matter, 70-BH-1, 2 sides) to make a more accurate looking B74a, with the door frames at the top having the corners squared off.  While a person would have to find an appropriate arched roof it may be an option to at least consider.  Below are links to the sides I am referring too...

http://n-scalevarnish.info/M&R/60-173.gif
http://n-scalevarnish.info/M&R/60-174.jpg

Quote
@Cajonpassfan , I see your point, and one could continue to shave away material from the opening to lower them in the recess further but you run the risk of damaging the sides top and bottom of the opening.  This is about as thin as I can have etches made without having them turn into aluminum foil.

I wonder if, by cutting out the cast on doors that a more appropriate look could be gained, with the door frame being built up on the inside to not only strengthen the framing but also to provide for a deeper look.  This will be something I will be looking at for some of my head-end cars, once I get serious about doing them.  Also, keep in mind that most heavyweight head-end cars had door frames trimmed in ¼ round placed on both sides of the doorway in a vertical position... Harriman cars are the exception but most had this detail... I just don't know if using Evergreen .030 thick ¼ round pieces would be small enough for this to work appropriately.

The MT PRR dining car trucks would be right for these cars but my question is whether or not they are available separately from the models?  These trucks, as well as the top equalized trucks used on the DL&W baggage car model, should both be very popular trucks to have available (the former because of PRR modelers while the latter could be attractive to those more inclined to being prototypically accurate, a huge number of Pullman sleepers and parlors used this type of truck)... I know I would like some of the latter for some of my cars!!!

thomasjmdavis

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2016, 05:00:04 PM »
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John,

Very impressive.  I think my favorite part of the hobby is taking a manufactured car, and making it into something completely different.  Just wish I had your talent.

Quote
I'm left a bit confused by all the hub-bub around the horse cars

As it happens, I was just looking up a factoid in Frank Ellington's book on ATSF Head End Cars, and in front of me is a photo of a Grand Canyon train at Cajon Pass- 3 Horse cars, fluted baggage, Budd chair car, PS chair car, HW diner, HW lounge, HW sleeper, 2 lightweight sleepers.  The whole thing behind ABA Erie Builts.  1954.

How do you NOT model that?  And if you are a purist, there must be a photo of a PRR equivalent.  Probably has a scenery car thrown in for good measure.
Tom D.

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Cajonpassfan

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2016, 05:25:19 PM »
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Ah, you must mean this one Tom.
Must have been a hot day on Cajon, as most of the doors are open. Totally unprototypical :P
Equine airconditioning?
Otto K.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2016, 05:27:21 PM by Cajonpassfan »

Dave V

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2016, 05:33:05 PM »
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As it happens, I was just looking up a factoid in Frank Ellington's book on ATSF Head End Cars, and in front of me is a photo of a Grand Canyon train at Cajon Pass- 3 Horse cars, fluted baggage, Budd chair car, PS chair car, HW diner, HW lounge, HW sleeper, 2 lightweight sleepers.  The whole thing behind ABA Erie Builts.  1954.

How do you NOT model that?  And if you are a purist, there must be a photo of a PRR equivalent.  Probably has a scenery car thrown in for good measure.

When it comes to my Pennsy stuff I usually prefer to model the everyday mundane...that which you were more likely to see (my HH-1 not withstanding!).  They're neat cars, though, don't get me wrong.
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nickelplate759

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2016, 06:37:23 PM »
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In that last picture it looks like weirdest resistor I've ever seen!
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thomasjmdavis

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2016, 07:32:35 PM »
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That's the one, Otto, although the copy in the book has all 3 locomotives.  I wondered about the open doors myself.  Having grown up in the age of OSHA (went into effect while I was in college), just not the sort of thing that happens nowadays.  Surprised that the horses would not be bothered by it, but I suppose they enjoyed the fresh air.

And that is one of the very few photos I've seen of the Erie Builts actually pulling a train.
Tom D.

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Lemosteam

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Re: PRR B74b build from an MT Horse car
« Reply #14 on: April 21, 2016, 08:01:49 PM »
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So John;   When are you going to sell a mod kit with all the goodies for the rest of us SPF's to roll our own B74B's.   I got get that Pennsy fix you know it highly addicting................. :P
s

@cgw Actually, as soon as I confirm the roof is ready for sale.  The etchings will be included in the price of the roof and sent when I confirm the customer and order in Shapeways. Sorry no pricing yet.