Modeling N-Scale Tank Cars

[unittrain]

Would really like to see more 60's-70's era tank cars as I would like to have a train with just tank cars and the blander the better it is much more prototypical, I purchased like 25 of the 5701 4 bay ACF covered hoppers when atlas released them all undec just for the purpose of recreating a unit plastics train that used to go through my town on the B&O in the late 70's early 80's the cars were all gray leasing company cars like ACFX and GATX as bland as you can get! But these trains really looked cool and so I figured to make an N scale version of that train. I also remember this was the first train I seen without a caboose in the summer of 1980 when all trains pretty much still had cabooses. So they must have been in the early stages of testing EOT's and what better train to do that on than a unit train where the cars usually stay together.

[TiVoPrince]

Mr. Wallet
votes for common and mundane.  Details like size and ends are important but a model that reaches the 85% level will probably be purchased every single time in multiple road numbers.  Get the manway, railings, rigging, fittings, lettering, and such looking pretty much correct and the credit card will fly for every run and every plausible roadnames.  If a tank is an inch or two off I'm probably going to ignore that.  Don't put the wrong ends on and I will decide 1980s, 2005 or both.  Probably some of both in the end...

I'm prepared to begin a candlelight vigil campaign almost immediately, if Y'all think it will help...

[GaryHinshaw]

I'm not sure if by "generic" you mean plain or you mean non-proto-specific, but it is NOT my intention to just create random tank cars with no real prototype.

I meant plain.  But when it comes to proto-specificity, my threshold for tank car accuracy is down in the 80% range (not that that has any real meaning), because the staggering variety of proto cars means that almost any model is somewhat foobic.  I'm pretty happy if the tank has the right length (within a scale foot or two) and diameter (within half a foot or so), and an approximately correct handrail/manway configuration.   Here is an example of a recent model that passed my threshold, an Atlas 23K tanker:

http://www.atlasrr.com/Images/NFreightCars/n235gallon/0712/50001118_TQ.jpg
http://www.railcarphotos.com/PhotoDetails.php?PhotoID=16110

Clearly there are differences in manway, railing, and valve details, (and I just now noticed the spiral construction on the proto) but to me the model captured enough of the look & feel to pass.

I count about 10 models from Atlas & Athearn that I own in quantity (my current tanker fleet is about 50 cars), so that's pretty decent variety already. But to paraphrase John D. Rockefeller's line about money: "How many tank car models do you need? Just a few more."

[ljudice]

With the exception of massive crude and ethanol fleets, aren't most tank cars almost custom made for a specific commodity/customer?

I totally support new 1970-2000+ tank cars, but I just think the real shortage these days is in the gondola department.... 

[Catt]

Anybody know the OD of a modern Ethanol tanker? I'd like \to try my hand at scratchbuilding a couple in Z scale.

[TrainReign]

Here's a suggestion.

Atlas needs to start putting body mounts on there tank cars and lowering them. They run too high.

[Denver Road Doug]

So, I think this thread is developing like I'd hoped.

I do indeed think that 80%,even though very subjective and nebulous, kind of paints a good picture of what I'm trying to get at.   And also the comment about tank cars being specific.   I guess the point is...scratchbuilding/kitbashing might be a little more appropriate for tank cars, IF the components are available and the research comes through.

My biggest problem is identifying cars and determining dimensions.   As it stands, I take one of MY photos, or one from online that doesn't have metadata, and try to cross reference with at least a "series" on sites like rrpicturearchives.net.   If I'm lucky, I'll find something in the range, that looks close, and has more dimensional data and/or other info.   And if I'm really lucky, that info is correct.   Then you can usually take the whole of the information and come up with something.  (I also have a couple of ORER's that help.)   But, all of it is pretty painstaking, and I'm still not convinced that in all cases the info online is right.   And, often I don't find matches to the cars.   And I have a lot of trouble just looking at a tank car photo and finding "spotting features" like we associate with locomotives.  Anyway, it just seems like maybe I just don't know all the tips and tricks of the trade to get the info I desire.

In all reality, we may be talking about scratchbuilding only a handful, or a dozen, two dozen tops...from my perspective.   So I would probably approach it as...figure out what are the "next 10" most popular cars that might make it off the drawing board, and then start modeling everything else outside of those that suits you.   As I said, I have tons of photos of cars that are relevant era-wise and locale-wise so I bet I can come up with some ideas.  And of course you guys' list could be completely different.   So that's where it could be cool to document and collarborate so that eventually we'd have a sort of "recipe book" on how to model various tank cars in n-scale.

[GaryHinshaw]

Catt, I don't know about the prototype (kind of DRD's point), but the Athearn ethanol tanker has an OD of 0.755" or 10'1" scale.  This would scale to 0.55" in Z.  If you used 1/2" tubing for the tank it would be 10% too small, which would probably be noticeable.  (The length of the tank itself is 4.05", or 54'0", and the overall length across the end platforms is 4.25", or 56'8".)

DRD, if I'm following you correctly, you would basically like something like a Car Builders 'Cyclopdia, where each entry corresponds to a car series (builder and number range), and gave build year, accurate dimensional data, identification of pertinent hardware (valves, etc.), semi-detailed drawings, and a reference to the nearest available model in N scale, right?  (No tall order, BTW.)

FWIW, www.railcarphotos.com has a listing of major car groups, which can be quite useful for getting a sense of the landscape, but it mostly applies to current prototypes.  The search column links to all the photos in a given group, for example these Trinity tankers.  Maybe that's a step in the right direction?

-gfh

[Rossford Yard]

Gary,

Those two photos you showed (Atlas and Prototype, with same number series, no less) are what I was referring to when I said I don't think the Atlas model captures the massive look of the proto.  To me, the Atlas body looks skinnier than its proto counterpart.

I guess the real commercial question for tankers is how many of us care to the level DRD and others here do?  For most modelers, are tank cars tank cars? It sure seems there is room for several nearly equal models of covered hoppers on the market, and to my eye, those differences are rarely important in buying more.  (IM 5161 being and exception, because it looks different and modern)  Also, we have at least five different types of autoracks over the years (bi, tri, Auto Max, Connected (Atlas)) and several gondola types (42, 50, 65, modern and older). 

Are tank cars so different just because they are plain black that some mfg won't jump in with a new model? (in N, since Walthers seems to do well with many tankers in HO....)

[sirenwerks]

With the exception of massive crude and ethanol fleets, aren't most tank cars almost custom made for a specific commodity/customer?

I totally support new 1970-2000+ tank cars, but I just think the real shortage these days is in the gondola department.... 

Yea, tank cars - like most locos and rolling stock actually - are different per batch, which is designated by the purchaser.  But there aren't that many tank car manufacturers these days so they are not so far from each other that a modeler couldn't grab the differences to create unique cars from a handful of body styles and, on occasion, dare I say it, some stock tubing and actual modeling. The figuring out what's different is the hard part. 

Someone gave me a Kato Japanese proto car that I am still trying to figure out what to do with.  Luckily I model earlier than the 70s, when there was more variety.  One day I'll run across a prototype I can use it for; but likely only the tank itself and not the frame or hardware.  My problem is I crack open the Morning Sun tank car books and every page is full of shiny objects and I can't focus...

[daniel_leavitt2000]

Doug, a few years ago I posted a how-to on upgrading the MDC 50' tanks:
https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=21226.msg200354#msg200354

I actually finished the decals. I will update that post with new photos as soon as my new computer arrives.

The CC 56' car has some uses. It looks similar to the larger UTLX cars that started appearing around 2000 with the side ladders recessed into the tank car. I am working on one of these. I'll dig it out and post photos too.

Don't forget the Atlas ACFX cars: 17k and 23k sizes. They can use BLMA trucks to reduce the height but otherwise they are pretty good. Atlas also makes the Koalin tanks that are usually pretty colorful.

I shot TONS of tank cars in 2003-2004 before all tank cars moved to those qualification/grid stencils. This was to photograph as much of the late 90's era cars as I could.

[sirenwerks]

Don't forget that the manufacturers' websites are a good source for information as well.  For instance - http://www.americanrailcar.com/RailcarManufacturing/Car.aspx?car=tank or http://www.gbrx.com/Tank_Cars.php?expandable=0