Author Topic: Brass E units- mysteries solved and searching- HELP  (Read 1290 times)

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u18b

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Brass E units- mysteries solved and searching- HELP
« on: July 20, 2013, 01:55:17 AM »
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I have made wonderful progress on the Kumata brass project.
I've figured out some puzzles and need more help.

This thread is about all the E units.  Maybe you can help fill a gap or two.

First, let's talk motors.
I have found three.

Here is the can motor made in Japan.


Here is a motor with straight magnets.


And here is one with curved magnets- more like we're used to now.




Now here is a history of E units with photos (and gaps).

1982 Nov 

Oriental  E1 ATSF
Learned from research that A was powered, but the B was a DUMMY.  150 sets were run.

I need a photo of the first run A chassis.

And I need a photo of the dummy B chassis.  I think this is VERY VERY rare.

This label is from the first run- I'm almost certain.




1984 April

Hallmark  E5 plated

Note, it has the can motor.



1984 May was a busy month

Hallmark  E3/6 brass AND plated versions

Here is a photo from spookshow.  We at first thought it must have been remotored-- but note it looks exactly like the E5 above.




Oriental E1 A&B both powered, 2nd run

Here is a photo Loren Perry sent me of his E1B.  He is 2nd or 3rd owner and has no idea what run.  However, since the first run was a DUMMY, it MUST be second run.  Notice Oriental used the straight sided motor.  Otherwise, it looks the same as the E5.  By the way, I would LOVE a photo of a confirmed 2nd run label.  Only 100 sets were in the second run.




Oriental E1B power chassis

Many people complained that their solo powered E1A could not pull the 8 car Superchief and a B unit- up a grade.   So Oriental relented and produced a power chassis (no shell) for the E1B dummies.  Just put the dummy shell on this chassis and now you are powered.  Note is has same straight motor, BUT the motor has been moved, it has been "Beardenized" by eliminating the right inner bearing, AND the opposing worm shaft has an extra support.

3 weeks after I discovered that such a chassis even existed, one showed up on ebay and I bought it!!!!!!!  And it still had the original box!!!  Since MOST people would have re-powered their dummy, I would think that a power chassis still in the box would be very very rare.




1985 Sept

Oriental B&O EA/EB

After a loooonnnnngggg delay because of painting/decal issues, oriental released the EA/EB.  Now, even though it was released later, it does NOT resemble the advancements of the E1B power chassis.  I suspect that's because they were ACTUALLY made in 1984 with the E1s, but sat on a shelf waiting to be painted.  Uses the round frame motor, and is the ONLY KMT loco to have BOTH gearboxes insulated and thus the shell and frame are  NOT electrified.  Also used 2 weights instead of 1.




That's it.  You would REALLY help me out if you have:
--E1 ATSF from the first run- I need powered A chassis and dummy B chassis.
--E1 set 2nd run label on the box.  Would love to compare.  My gut tells me there are differences.
--E3/6 chassis.  Spook and I just aren't certain of his photo- so we would like a confirmation.
--E3/6 plated version.  I would LOVE a photo of the assembled units (with shell).

You could either loan me something or just get me good quality photos.

And as always, special thanks to the MANY people who have helped me.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2013, 02:25:00 AM by u18b »
Ron Bearden
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"All get what they want-- not all like what they get."  Aslan the Lion in the Chronicles of Narnia by C.S.Lewis.

u18b

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Re: Brass E units- mysteries solved and searching- HELP
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2013, 08:12:27 AM »
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I got to thinking.  Suppose you had an E1 set.  But didn't really know what run it is.

How would you tell?

Well, (unless someone mixed and matched the set-- which I will assume is unlikely)....

the key is the B unit.

The B unit is either powered or unpowered.

If it is a dummy, then you have a first run for sure.  I need to know what both A and dummy B look like.

If you have a powered B unit, then which does it look like?

If it has a centered motor, then it is second run for sure.  I don't need a chassis shot, but would like a label shot from run 2.



However, if the motor is to one side, then it is definitely the first run- and the B unit has been changed over to the power chassis.  In that situation, I don't need a shot of the B unit, but I do need the A unit.


And to the moderator who adjusted my code to make the photos smaller--- thanks.   8)





Ron Bearden
CSX N scale Archivist
http://u18b.com

"All get what they want-- not all like what they get."  Aslan the Lion in the Chronicles of Narnia by C.S.Lewis.

u18b

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Re: Brass E units- mysteries solved and searching- HELP
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2013, 02:41:01 PM »
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Just bumping for a little more time.

No ATSF brass E1 fans here?

(or E3/6)
Ron Bearden
CSX N scale Archivist
http://u18b.com

"All get what they want-- not all like what they get."  Aslan the Lion in the Chronicles of Narnia by C.S.Lewis.

Loren Perry

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Re: Brass E units- mysteries solved and searching- HELP
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2013, 11:26:03 PM »
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I'm a HUGE fan of the original EMD E-1's, especially the ATSF 2-spot class, probably the most beautiful diesel locomotives ever to ride the rails. I also have a soft spot for all the slant-nose diesels.

superturbine

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Re: Brass E units- mysteries solved and searching- HELP
« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2013, 12:04:30 AM »
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Hey, I have a set also.  Keep it coming.

superturbine

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Re: Brass E units- mysteries solved and searching- HELP
« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2013, 12:58:10 AM »
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Here is my 1st run set of E1's.... Dummy B unit.
Yes.... I will try to get them to you.  Here are pictures for now-
1st run ATSF E1's






« Last Edit: July 23, 2013, 01:01:58 AM by superturbine »

u18b

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Re: Brass E units- mysteries solved and searching- HELP
« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2013, 01:18:07 AM »
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WOW!!!!!  Thanks! You da man!!!

These are the only shots I've ever seen of these.

Clearly first run since the B unit is a dummy.

Also, wow!  Look at that A unit.  At first glance, it resembles the power chassis offered later (motor shifted to one side.).

But in actuality, it has more in common with the SD40-2 which was released only one month before.

Ron Bearden
CSX N scale Archivist
http://u18b.com

"All get what they want-- not all like what they get."  Aslan the Lion in the Chronicles of Narnia by C.S.Lewis.

spookshow

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Re: Brass E units- mysteries solved and searching- HELP
« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2013, 08:21:06 AM »
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Hey Ron, you should sell him your replacement E1B power chassis  :D



Cheers,
-Mark