Painting & Weathering Track

[peteski]

Actually, I think a better approach is to remove all of the copper except for a square under the rail (thus simulating a tieplate), then scribe woodgrain into the PCB material.

This Code 40 switch is handlaid on 100% PCB ties.

That looks awesome but it is A LOT of tedious work just to make a single switch!
I could see making one or two as a proof of concept but I can't imagine peeling copper foil from ties of 50 or 100 switches needed for the entire layout. 

[rschaffter]

The flanges are in the background and IMO, they don't look all that bad....
What I find amusing is that modelers go to the great lengths to make their track and scenery look realistic but they somehow develop a blind spot for the lack of realism in the model which sits on that beautiful track. Large flanges? Sure but that is not what sticks out like a sore thumb in this picture.   How about those toysh, horribly oversized flat metal stampings which are standing in for side rods and the rest of the valve gear?!  To me this photo looks like someone put a Lionel model on some finely detailed track.  The realism is lost.

Yes, I do see that the siderods were blackened to make them less obtrusive. I also realize that this is a 40 plus year old model made by Atlas/Rivarossi/Con-Cor and it was designed during the infancy of N scale. Still, wouldn't it be nice if someone offered a retrofit kit for siderods and valve gear for those older locos? Something finely relief-etched in stainless steel (like the ones used on Kato Mikados).

This is not a put-down directed at rschaffter or at any specific modeler - just a general observation after looking at that photo.  Those siderods literally poked me in the eye what I first glanced at the photo.

No offense taken, Pete.   I bought that locomotive as new old stock from Carl of Cama Train in Chicago at a train show decades ago (I think I paid $20), and reworked in the late 1980s.  It has a Sagami motor and runs pretty well, but not on Atlas Code 55 track with those flanges. I put it in the shot for sentimental reasons.  Regarding the flanges, one thing that is really evident to me is how undersized the drivers had to be to accommodate the deep flanges...

Unfortunately I don't think the economics are there for a retrofit, especially when a MP Mike can be acquired for $100 or so...

BTW, here it is in action before the rework, back in 1986 or so...

[BCR 570]

Actually, I think a better approach is to remove all of the copper except for a square under the rail (thus simulating a tieplate), then scribe woodgrain into the PCB material.

Thank you David and others for your suggestions.  As all of my track is handlaid I dont think I have the time to work on all of hte PC ties - I really want to get some track down and start running trains.  Looking at the images of finished track on the Fast Tracks website, they do not appear to stand out.  I was thinking of some way to plug the two gaps in the top of each tie but haven't thought of a suitable material to use for that.  It needs to be something I can spread on top of the tie and level off to fill the gaps.

I am now instaling joint bars on the visible sides of the rails which is going to take a while.  I also want to try one more experiment which is to start with a slightly darker shade of grey than what I have tried so far.

Tim

[hminky]

I use this stuff in the 5-minute version to fill the gaps in PCB ties:



It can be mixed in small quantities, sticks great, sets fast and is easily filed or shaved level.

Harold

[Sokramiketes]

And here are some close-ups of some hastily assembled track painted Light Grey, ties washed with Raw Umber, and rails painted Floquil Rail Brown:




I think that the next step may be to do a short section on roadbed with ballast for the 100 per cent finished evaluation.

Your thoughts welcomed,

Tim

Ties look great.

The railbrown I'm afraid will be too light.  The photo above is backlit, so the rails look nice and dark because they're in shadow like real rail often is.  The problem is that model railroad photographs are often lit from the side.  And that exaggerates light rail colors to the point that they stick out like a sore thumb.  I'd consider using your tie method with a nice dark rail color.  Roof brown or darker.

Also, if you use masking tape to paint the rail separately after the ties are done... then leave it off the rail to the width of a tie plate.  Then you can just paint the tie plates in place.  The dark brown on your light ties woule really look like separate tie plates have been applied! 

[BCR 570]

Mike:

Excellent comments - thank you.  I had in fact determined that the Rail Brown was too light after comparing it with my prototype photographs.  The Neolube is darker but I do not know if it will still to painted rails (they get sprayed in the first stage of hte process I am using with the grey primer).  I will try the Roof Brown as I think I have some lying around.

Tim

[craigolio1]

That looks awesome but it is A LOT of tedious work just to make a single switch!
I could see making one or two as a proof of concept but I can't imagine peeling copper foil from ties of 50 or 100 switches needed for the entire layout. 

It would be tedious one by one.  However, could be done on mass by making a quick jig to hold maybe 15 ties, a styrene over lay with rails cut out, and simply swiping a resist pen down the ties in the cut out bit.  Once you've done this to 100 or 200 or 1000 ties, toss them in the acid for a bit and rinse.  Easy.

The same could be done by making a styrene template to lay over PCB ties in a Fasttrax, or similar, assembly jig.  It would take longer than straight track but then turnouts always do.

That being said, remember that the copper on the PCB is only held on with an adhesive.  You don't really need the use a PCB tie and solder to assemble track.  While the solder is strong, the weakest link is still the bond between the board and the copper.  If your using a jig to assemble track then the combined strength of adhesive at every rail/tie union is plenty to hold everything together. 

Tim, have you concidered getting rid of the PCB all together, at least on the non-turnout ties?

Food for thought. 

Craig

[ednadolski]

One thing I tried a while back with building a turnout in HO scale was to use all wood ties in the normal places, then put gapped PCB ties in between the wood ones.  The key was to use thinner PCB ties that sit lower than the wood ties, and use small brass spacers to make up the height difference. The ballast then completely covers the PCB ties so that they are never seen.  So you get a turnout with all-wood appearance and all-soldered construction.

I think it should scale down to N fairly well, in fact in some ways it might be more effective since the lack of tieplates & spikes is less noticeable in N.   I have it on my list of Things I Want To Try Out Sooner Rather Than Later   

Ed

[robert3985]

One thing I tried a while back with building a turnout in HO scale was to use all wood ties in the normal places, then put gapped PCB ties in between the wood ones.  The key was to use thinner PCB ties that sit lower than the wood ties, and use small brass spacers to make up the height difference. The ballast then completely covers the PCB ties so that they are never seen.  So you get a turnout with all-wood appearance and all-soldered construction.

I think it should scale down to N fairly well, in fact in some ways it might be more effective since the lack of tieplates & spikes is less noticeable in N.   I have it on my list of Things I Want To Try Out Sooner Rather Than Later   

Ed

Wow...THAT's an interesting concept! PCB ties in N-scale are already not as thick as wood, scale-sized ties, but not by much.  You'd have to find pretty thin PCB ties to cover 'em up with ballast. Hmmmmm....just thinkin'....

Lack of tieplates and spikes is only less noticeable in N-scale if you're not looking for them.  Unfortunately, I'm always looking for 'em.

Cheers!
Bob Gilmore

[ednadolski]

You'd have to find pretty thin PCB ties to cover 'em up with ballast.

Alternately, one could shim up the wood ties by the same amount.   That of course also means thinning the underlying roadbed.

Raise the bridge vs. lower the water, right? 

Ed

[ednadolski]

Lack of tieplates and spikes is only less noticeable in N-scale if you're not looking for them.  Unfortunately, I'm always looking for 'em.

Apologies if I had missed this previously, but may I ask -- do you do anything to paint/stain the rails/plates/ties a different color from each other?   I've found that without a contrasting color, they all blend together, almost like camouflage, esp. after ballasting and weathering.

The other part is that in order to be visible on the layout, this needs pretty strong lighting.  But maybe that's just me. 

Ed

[BCR 570]

After several weeks of experimentation, during which I received much sage advice from fellow forumers here, the time has come to paint and weather the track sections for the mainline.  The final step in assembly of the track sections was to scribe joints across the tops of the rails at 39 foot intervals, and then use these as locating marks for the etched joint bars.  Cutting out and attaching the joint bars was very time consuming and fiddly work, and there were some places where they would just not stick to the rails.  I also elected to omit them from the turnouts to avoid any potential problems with performance there.  The turnouts on this branch line did not seem to have too much in the way of reinforcement other than the point rails, but in N Scale Code 40 these are so delicate that I did not want to add anything to them and then have to try and remove them if it didnt work.  After installing the joint bars and priming the track I find that they are barely noticeable; perhaps one will surprise me and turn up in a future macro photograph.  What I was pleased with was the effect of the scribed rail joints - the effect is subtle but it is there.  Finally, on a suggestion from Mark and others, I roughed up the tie surface texture a little with a small wire brush.  Now on to painting and weathering.

Step 1 - Light Gray Primer Coat
As stated earlier in this thread, for my particular prototype, I find that most painted/weathered model railway track appears to be too dark ie. almost black.  I recognize that this is appropriate for other applications, but I am after that fading creosote branch line look.  I decided to try a slightly darker shade of gray than the one initially used, and settled on Testors Model Master Aircraft Gray.  This stage really required an airbrush and it needed to be done outside, so it was done with the assistance of my friend John Walter in his back yard.  The track sections were sprayed underneath and then on top.  Unfortunately I failed to realize the high amount of overspray when painting track and I seriously underestimated the amount of paint required.  We ran out of the colour I was using and other similar colours were substituted.  A little variety doesn't hurt, does it?  The primer coat was then allowed to dry and harden for several days, as the next step requires significant use of paint thinner.  Here are all of the track sections for my main line after application of the primer coat:





Lessons Learned
1. Use a light gray for the primer coat to help heighten the contrast between differing shades of the tie stain.
2. Allow for significant overspray when purchasing the primer paint to avoid running out in the middle of the job.
3. Apply the primer coat lightly ie. not too heavy to avoid pooling of paint on the PC ties and obscuring the wood grain.
4. Allow the primer coat to dry and harden for several days to avoid removal during the next step.


Tim

[BCR 570]

Step 2 - Raw Umber Tie Stain
At the suggestion of Gary, I switched from Burnt Umber to Raw Umber and am pleased with the results.  This stage consists of mixing Raw Umber artists oil paint with paint thinner and applying a wash over the ties.  This applies well on the wood ties, but a higher ratio of paint to thinner is required for the PC ties.  This is to avoid pooling as the PC ties do not absorb the stain, and also to avoid removing the primer coat and revealing the bright shiny copper (not what we want!).  I used a paper blotter to get the mix just right.  I began by applying the stain to the underside of the ties in both directions.  I am not too worried about coverage on the lower half of the ties as they will be immersed in ballast.  I then flipped the track upright and applied the stain to the ties outside the rail, taking care to cover the ends, and then in between the rails.  After a few minutes I went back and redistributed any paint which I felt was pooling up or threatening to dry too dark.  It is important not to overdo the stain - the beauty of this method is that successive coats can be applied to darken it, whereas trying to lighten a stain which went on too dark would be more problematic.  After application of the stain, I used a wood block to remove paint from the tops of the rails while it is still easy to get off.  Here are the materials used:




Here is the first section of track during the process of applying the tie stain:




Lessons Learned
1. Raw Umber is a more appropriate colour in order to achieve the look I am after.
2. Low odour paint thinner makes this job more pleasant.  Adequate ventilation also helps.
3. Apply the stain lightly - successive coats can be applied to darken it if required.
4. A higher ratio of paint to thinner is required for staining the PC ties.


Tim

[BCR 570]

Step 3 - Roof Brown for Rails
In my earlier experiments I masked off the ties and the rails were airbrushed with Rail Brown.  I was concerned about the length of time required to mask all of the track sections, and was concerned about the tape potentially removing paint from the PC ties.  With a little practice I learned that it was fairly easy to paint the rails with a small brush, which I could do here at home in the layout room, and in far less time than all of the masking and spraying.  Acting on a suggestion from Mike Skibbe, I tried using Roof Brown in lieu of Rail Brown.  Rail Brown was a little too close in colour to the Raw Umber Tie Stain, and lighter than what I was seeing in my prototype photographs.  Roof Brown is a closer match, and offers some subtle contrast against the ties.  I used a 2/0 size brush which was about the right size for Code 40 rail.  For my Code 55 to Code 40 transition track sections at either end of the helix the brush seemed to be a litttle small, so I would recommend a larger brush size for Code 55 rail.  This step proved to be one of the easiest and went fairly quickly.  The brush is guided along by the head and web of the rail, and careful monitoring of the amount of paint on the brush ensures a correct balance between enabling paint flow and avoiding spillage onto the ties.  Here is one of the first sections of track about to receive the Roof Brown rail treatment:




Lessons Learned
1. For my prototype, Roof Brown offers a good match as well as a contrast with the Raw Umber tie stain.
2. The easiest method of application is with a small good quality paint brush (size 2/0 for Code 40 rail).
3. Shaking and stirring the paint well helps to ensure a good flow of paint along the rail.
4. Monitoring the amount of paint on the brush helps to avoid spillage onto the ties.


In my earlier posts to this thread I did not mention that after each step I used a wood block to remove paint from the tops of the rails.  I initially used one of the Peco track cleaning blocks but this generated a fair amount of powder which then coated the freshly painted track - no thanks!  The wood block solves this problem by absorbing the paint removed from the tops of the rails.  This is best done immediately after the paint has been applied.  The wood block can be dipped in paint thinner to help remove any stubborn paint; however I found that the amount of thinner had to be monitored carefully to avoid having it dribble down onto the ties.  After dipping the block into the paint thinner I blotted it on paper before placing it on the rails, and that seemed to work well.  The shiny rails contrast nicely with the painted rails and stained ties.

With these three steps completed, the first track sections are now ready for the attachment of feeder wires and installation on the layout.  I am thinking that once installed and ballasted, I will likely spray the track with a very thin coat of something to blend it all together.


Tim

[Ed Kapuscinski]

I too learned that Raw Umber is the shiz... that's what I just used on the layout. I used a craft paint though. Squeezed it out of the tube onto the roadbed, and applied it with a rather cheap brush. What can I say, I'm impatient, and wanted to get the whole layout done quickly...