Author Topic: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)  (Read 24856 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

sirenwerks

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 6027
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +506
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #105 on: July 17, 2010, 06:31:42 PM »
0
My gosh, why not do what Bachmann is doing?  Offer a product at an MSRP that is 20% less than what the competition is offering it for?   And then maintain that price come hell or high-water.   

And Bachmann's a product that is desired or, at the very least, creates (immediate) consumer interest. And a quality product to boot.

That's not to say that Walthers doesn't create quality product but it's hit or miss. The 4427 was nice, though not BLMA nice, but it was a good starting point for those who want to go the extra mile and detail it. The modular wall kits though, IMO, were crap. The horizontal wall joints were very poorly engineered and the line never grew either, like Woodland Scenics'.

Not really Walthers product but the Eastern caboose is good, but they hype it by calling it improved when it really isn't and still they charge a super-premium price for it.

The company just seems out of touch with N scale, like they're trying to apply cookie cutter HO marketing tactics developed in the late 50s to something that really started to bloom twenty years later (I use Odegard's Clinchfield as a benchmark), and is only hitting a pique now in terms of potential. I'd wager the psychographic differences between followers of the two scales are considerable. And that the differences would warrant separate product development schemes.
Failing to prepare is preparing to fail.

DKS

  • The Pitt
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 13424
  • Respect: +7027
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #106 on: July 17, 2010, 07:30:02 PM »
0
The company just seems out of touch with N scale...

Obviously the success (or non-success) of the respective N scale manufacturers is a function of their corporate staff. If the decision-makers are operating on faulty assumptions or skewed biases, then the product line will reflect that. Look at BLMA: high enthusiasm and a can-do attitude for N scale, and very well-connected with the buyers; then look at the results. Very likely the only hope of seeing this sort of performance from Walthers and other borderline-N-scale suppliers is for some big changes at the top, either by replacement, or by somehow convincing current managers that there are opportunities to be had.

MichaelWinicki

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 2096
  • Respect: +335
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #107 on: July 17, 2010, 07:39:05 PM »
0
My gosh, why not do what Bachmann is doing?  Offer a product at an MSRP that is 20% less than what the competition is offering it for?   And then maintain that price come hell or high-water.   

And Bachmann's a product that is desired or, at the very least, creates (immediate) consumer interest. And a quality product to boot.

That's not to say that Walthers doesn't create quality product but it's hit or miss. The 4427 was nice, though not BLMA nice, but it was a good starting point for those who want to go the extra mile and detail it. The modular wall kits though, IMO, were crap. The horizontal wall joints were very poorly engineered and the line never grew either, like Woodland Scenics'.

Not really Walthers product but the Eastern caboose is good, but they hype it by calling it improved when it really isn't and still they charge a super-premium price for it.

The company just seems out of touch with N scale, like they're trying to apply cookie cutter HO marketing tactics developed in the late 50s to something that really started to bloom twenty years later (I use Odegard's Clinchfield as a benchmark), and is only hitting a pique now in terms of potential. I'd wager the psychographic differences between followers of the two scales are considerable. And that the differences would warrant separate product development schemes.

See, I think Walther's does understand the N-scale market. 

I don't see them as ignorant...

Instead I see them as arrogant.

The overall affect is about the same, it's just a different path of getting there.  ;)

up1950s

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 9956
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +2871
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #108 on: July 17, 2010, 07:43:35 PM »
0
N scale folks spend plenty on plenty of stuff . If Walther's choses to not tap into well by not producing what we care to spend money on , and through many forums the want list is loudly spoken , then so be it . It will be both our loss , but their choice . Life goes on .


Richie Dost

ljudice

  • Guest
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #109 on: July 17, 2010, 07:44:12 PM »
0
Why the pessimism?

Look, proprietary n-scale has been a failure for Walthers, mostly due to their own misreading the market. They're dabbling again - in a low investment  mode - and only time will tell. But if the Greenville and other good things they make are successful, then the situation will certainly improve.

At least they're talking about what they are doing to the press/bloggers, which I can't say for most of the other major players.  (Compare employee participation at Atlas HO Forum to Atlas N Forum, for example).

TiVoPrince

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 5156
  • Respect: +4
    • http://www.technologywrangler.com
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #110 on: July 17, 2010, 09:28:18 PM »
0
Bachmann
does not have a monthly sales flyer to fill every month. 

Walthers has comitted to a different pricing structure, not necessarily better or worse just differrent.  If Walthers is not making some coin when the product is on sale they need new accountants (Enron graduates apply now) and product managers because the basic business model is fatally flawed. 

I want Walthers to succeed with products at a fair price but I will not buy a kit immediately upon release, unless I really cannot move forward without it.  Walters items on a 25% off sale is as certain as the sun coming up in the morning.  Modelers all know all about it and will always be counted on to act in thier own self interest, creating an impossible situation for LHS who need to stock product to generate regular sales but get trampled by the rush when Walthers runs a monthly sale and can do nothing more than restock at the sale price but may never recover that full price investment in Walthers product...
Support fine modeling

Ed Kapuscinski

  • Global Moderator
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 26058
  • Head Kino
  • Respect: +11526
    • Conrail 1285
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #111 on: July 17, 2010, 09:54:25 PM »
0
Very likely the only hope of seeing this sort of performance from Walthers and other borderline-N-scale suppliers is for some big changes at the top, either by replacement, or by somehow convincing current managers that there are opportunities to be had.

... or by them buying out a Fox Valley or BLMA for the talent (not the products), but I don't see that happening. Can you imagine Craig as the Director of Marketing at Walthers? Actually, with his talent and smarts, I think we'd see him as the Director of Marketing at someplace like Apple or Google.

sirenwerks

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 6027
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +506
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #112 on: July 18, 2010, 01:21:45 AM »
0
It seems like they don't hire top employees, they breed them. Didn't a daughter just take over marketing? Historically, when family-run businesses get so big, they start to have, um, dysfunctions that effect business performance.
Failing to prepare is preparing to fail.

up1950s

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 9956
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +2871
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #113 on: July 18, 2010, 01:57:04 AM »
0
It seems like they don't hire top employees, they breed them. Didn't a daughter just take over marketing? Historically, when family-run businesses get so big, they start to have, um, dysfunctions that effect business performance.

Perhaps akin to inbreeding .


Richie Dost

Robbman

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 3007
  • Respect: +18
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #114 on: July 18, 2010, 02:05:05 AM »
0
For what its worth, here are a few photos I took yesterday.

Walthers 2 bay hopper test shot:



For 16.95 that just looks crude... compare that to the $1 more when announced and $2 more now BLMA TopGon... those extra dollars gets you separate (and correct) interior bracing, finer molded on handrail and stirrup detail, and an etched metal brake platform... I haven't seen the brake cylinder detail yet, so I can't comment... I knew I should have done this car years ago.

James Costello

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 1954
  • Respect: +534
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #115 on: July 18, 2010, 04:19:53 AM »
0
I wish it was BLMA quality too Robbman....

Do we think that is a body mount pad visible on the right hand side?
Happy days if so....
James Costello
Espee into the 90's

ljudice

  • Guest
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #116 on: July 18, 2010, 08:17:23 AM »
0
Robbman, do the 4 bay Greenville hoppers!!!    Hint, hint!

inkaneer

  • Guest
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #117 on: July 18, 2010, 09:16:15 AM »
0
N scale folks spend plenty on plenty of stuff . If Walther's choses to not tap into well by not producing what we care to spend money on , and through many forums the want list is loudly spoken , then so be it . It will be both our loss , but their choice . Life goes on .

If a 'manufacturer made a product that no one wanted and then, as a result, left the market, would it make any difference?

inkaneer

  • Guest
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #118 on: July 18, 2010, 09:20:31 AM »
0
Bachmann
does not have a monthly sales flyer to fill every month. 

Walthers has comitted to a different pricing structure, not necessarily better or worse just differrent.  If Walthers is not making some coin when the product is on sale they need new accountants (Enron graduates apply now) and product managers because the basic business model is fatally flawed. 

I want Walthers to succeed with products at a fair price but I will not buy a kit immediately upon release, unless I really cannot move forward without it.  Walters items on a 25% off sale is as certain as the sun coming up in the morning.  Modelers all know all about it and will always be counted on to act in thier own self interest, creating an impossible situation for LHS who need to stock product to generate regular sales but get trampled by the rush when Walthers runs a monthly sale and can do nothing more than restock at the sale price but may never recover that full price investment in Walthers product...

True, unfortunate as it is.  Walthers Turntable was and is priced at $299.00.  Yet some time ago they were blowing them out the door at $169.00.  That is when I got mine.  I only wish I got two of them.

asarge

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 1675
  • Respect: +24
Re: NTS update 7/15/2010 (Walthers's lets the cat of the bag)
« Reply #119 on: July 18, 2010, 10:27:48 AM »
0
Quote
I knew I should have done this car years ago.

Yeah, well ya' didn't, but ya' but ya' did great w/the other stuff. So WKW will do it and it will be ok, not great but ok. And you will move on to even better things while Lou bounces off the walls.  ;D

Overall, they weren't bad on announcements. The FVM custom paint jobs for the Atlas Evans Plug Door Boxacars are cool too!

Sorry we didn't all get what we wanted, but that't the way it goes!