rethinking the layout

[davefoxx]

Why not the Laurel Valley Ry.?  I know where you can get some hoppers, and they're not foobies.  ;D

[wm3798]

He'd have to pay a lot for the copyright...

[asciibaron]

He'd have to pay a lot for the copyright...

i can't afford any more Pollock Johnnies.

[choochin3]

My Aunt lives near Bluestone in a town called Pocahontas Va.,and we try to visit every year.
On our last visit 4 years ago I took some photos of the restored Bluestone station,and folowed the old line a lil bit.
If we go this year I could get some pics for you.

[Iain]

[DKS]

Heck, I thought everyone liked waffles.

[2-8-8-0]

Dont worry, you have a huge selection of equipment available for your chosen road in N.

Provided your chosen road is BNSF or that "yellow" one, that is ;D

To be fair, N&W modelers probably get the best articulated steamer (possibly best steamer of any type) on the market, but dosent help you much with 1967 I suppose. Surprised that with those locos running around, no one has taken the opportunity to provide hoppers to go with 'em tho...

[wm3798]

Yeah, but the N&W dieselized with the same enthusiasm that Virginia desegregated...  1218 and 611 were kept on the shelf just in case there was a return to the "good old days"...

Lee

[Dave V]

Steve, you just need to figure out what you're passionate about.  What give you train wood?  Seriously...  Case in point:  I can watch this UP and BNSF stuff out here all the live long day with only mild interest...  But seeing that matched set of CR SD40-2s out on Rockville in May got my heart racing.  I'll get excited just thinking about the story my grandfather told of riding behind triple-headed K4s around Horseshoe on his way to Pittsburgh.  There must be something on steel wheels that excites you more than anything else.  Finding and modeling that thing may be the ONLY thing that makes you happy.  And maybe, like the East Broad Top, it may not be something you can practically do in N. 

But it has to be your passion, not something that comes from a givens/druthers matrix, in order to be a lasting source of joy.

[Mark5]

To be fair, N&W modelers probably get the best articulated steamer (possibly best steamer of any type) on the market, but dosent help you much with 1967 I suppose.

Unfortunately the Y-3 in the late 40s and 50s isn't much of a mainline loco.

I like the one I have though!

Mark

[JDouglasFisher]

Unsolicited advice.

How about changing your perspective? As we all saw with the LHR design, the "Perspective" was that of a train crew (regardless of local or through trains). Idea being that you "traveled" over the line, thus needing the "perceived" distance to achieve that feeling of actually going somewhere.

Your complaint is that you cannot achieve that "perceived distance traveled" within the confines of the basement with the LHR concept.

But.....

By changing your perspective from that of merely the train crew to perhaps a tower operator, now new opportunities unfold.

In keeping in line with the LHR (assuming you have purchased some equipment already) might I suggest Campbell Hall - Burnside - Maybrook, NY region?

Makes for a almost perfect triangle (which can be adapted for those nights when you need to continuously run some new equipment for break in), gives you the opportunity to model various railroads and their varied equipment (NH, LNE, LHR, NYOW, Erie, NYC, thats a true rainbow of colors if I've ever seen one), 2 junctions (Campbell Hall and Burnside) and the variety of train traffic and operations should definitely keep most operators busy (not all trains terminated in Maybrook for instance)

I'd definitely suggest the mid 50's, before the "Old and Weary" quit the business of railroading to get the most bang for your buck. I believe everything you'd need locomotive wise is available in N (including 44 tonners for the O&W)

Just a thought. Change perspective, play around with the idea a bit, you might find that you can get more mileage out of this concept than say modeling some obscure branchline.

Just a thought,

J

[2-8-8-0]

Ill try and be a bit more helpful this post!

I had a very hard time deciding between C&O "sometime in the late 1940s" and WM, in the "early 1960s" so, simply...I didnt decide. WM is too cool not to like, and C&O fuels the need for steam!

I prefer scenery and watching trains go roundy round to big yards and stuff anyway, and mine tipples in southern W Va in 1948 wouldnt be a whole lot different from ones in central W Va in 1962 in the event I do want some kind of operations. Could you get away with something like this?

Its your railroad, after all

[asciibaron]

JDF, appreciate your advice and have been down that road with layouts years ago.  i lost interest very quickly because everything was built around a specific place. it felt too static, like i was looking out a window and the trains were the background.  i prefer to follow a train from scene to scene and enjoy the spaces between the scenes.  i think that's why i'm having such a  hard time getting to a point that i'm comfortable, i've built many layouts over the years and progressed from the roundy-round 4x8 scenic display to more operations based layouts.  i feel like i'm stepping back to a place i have been before and it's annoying.  i want to have a quality run experience, even in my limited space.  following the train is important in conveying that drama of railroading.  big things in bigger spaces.

considering that i will typically operate the layout by myself or with my sons, i really don't need to have a jammed pack list of trains to run - maybe a mine turn, a local, and a through freight that makes a loop while i work the mine or switch the industries.  the Bluestone branch is not going to be flexible in terms of MTY and loads - i will have to stage loads at the mines before operating - even if i wanted to just goof off and run some trains, it would be a PITA to reset the railroad.  the beauty of the L&HR is the mine is zinc and that means covered hoppers.  the downside, there is only one mine.  on a small layout, the mine turn won't take much time, but i wouldn't have to worry about open cars and them lying.

if i look at what aspects i want from a layout, i think that will dictate how things shape up.  i also have to stop looking at the real distances and locations - i should be more after the spirit and character of the line, not the physical reality.  that has been a stumbling point as i strive for more realistic operations.  i need to condense the prototype and work from there.  that is the hardest part, what aspects of the prototype make it stand out from others.

for me, a layout needs to have three things:

1- local switching - i love sorting out switch problems, they take time and give the layout purpose
2- a turn that drops MTY's and pulls loads off a branch - that just screams railroading to me since that's what i grew up watching
3- manifest freights that has drops and pickups for the local at some wide spot on the railroad.

the L&HR satisfied those needs but at a price.  since the L&HR would run two trains with one job, that made it difficult to replicate with hidden staging.  i have no way around it other than to ignore it.  and thus the problem with a short bridge route - it's hard to ignore such an interesting aspect of the prototype.

a bunch of grist for the mill here.

[MichaelWinicki]

Gosh, no matter what prototype you pick you're going to end up ignoring something.  Either the prototype will be running too many trains compared to what you can or there's not enough industrial switching to make it interesting or the yard is too big or... You get the idea.

I thought your previous plan was a darned good one... Staging at each end of the main.  A small yard.  Plenty of industry and a nice lengthy branch line.

It was a good plan.

[asciibaron]

I thought your previous plan was a darned good one... Staging at each end of the main.  A small yard.  Plenty of industry and a nice lengthy branch line.

It was a good plan.

it was a good plan on paper.  once i started to build it, it became obvious the yard was too big, the main line run that wasn't blocked or would be blocked by scenery was very short, and the run up the branch wouldn't stand apart from the main given the grade separation.  once you put a 12-15 car train on the railroad, the train came out of staging and right into the yard.  i think that layout could work with a smaller yard - maybe 3 tracks that could hold 16 cars total. the yard as designed could hold nearly twice that amount - it just consumed the space.

i haven't given up on the L&HR completely as a prototype - i'm just finding it hard to do it justice, if that makes sense.  i don't want to grab some plan off the shelf and call it the L&HR.  it's important for the story of the model to fit with the story of the prototype.

now with that said, a gem of wisdom was thrown out earlier - maybe it's time to look at some modern short lines - no, not the Maryland Midland.  who has local switching, a mine turn, and through freights?  and does it with Alcos