Author Topic: 2-1-1 Observation Car  (Read 4885 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

keystonecrossings

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 590
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: 0
    • Middle Division Musings
2-1-1 Observation Car
« on: January 11, 2010, 01:03:35 PM »
0
Surprised nobody has mentioned the newly announced Centralia 2-1-1 observation...



Figured there would be much rejoicing among N scale SPF's!
Jerry Britton, PRRT&HS #6111
PRR Middle Division in HO Scale - http://jbritton.pennsyrr.com
Keystone Crossings - http://pennsyrr.com

Mark5

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 8966
  • Always with the negative waves Moriarty ...
  • Respect: +170
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2010, 01:07:25 PM »
0
Is this different than the Kato PS 2-1-1? ???

Sokramiketes

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 3894
  • Proactive advocate of truthiness
  • Respect: +133
    • Modutrak
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2010, 02:22:23 PM »
0
Is this different than the Kato PS 2-1-1? ???

Unfortunantly, no. 

Schemes on the left are accurate, on the right "close-enoughs".  But, this is probably the most generic prototype for a P-S obs, hence the duplication.

Mike

www.modutrak.com
Better modeling through peer pressure...

Bob Bufkin

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 6396
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +42
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2010, 02:27:10 PM »
0
First I've seen these Jerry.  Thanks for the info.

Mark5

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 8966
  • Always with the negative waves Moriarty ...
  • Respect: +170
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2010, 02:32:35 PM »
0
Ah, so I suppose they could "close enough" this one:


(1949 with skirts!)

I managed to bag the Kato undec years back, but some J owners out there might be interested.

Mark

NYC1956

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 124
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: 0
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2010, 03:49:49 PM »
0
We knew they were tooling up a new observation, but now it has been announced. Apparently it is a Pullman plan 4082 2-1-1 observation lounge car. That makes it correct for the Southern Pacific, New York Central, and Baltimore and Ohio at least. It is probably a good stand-in for a few other roads as well.

This is essentially the same observation car that Kato supplied in the smooth-side sets it sold some years back.

For NYC modelers, this is not the famous "Creek" series cars of the 20th Century Limited. Those cars had the tall "Lookout Lounge" windows toward the rear. This car is the "River" series, of which there were three. There are four evenly-spaced lounge windows on each side at the rear. These cars did see service on the Century during World War II when the "Island" series observation were prevented from being used due to wartime requirements on revenue space. The "Island" series cars were stored. After the war they were refurbished and restored to service on the Century until the "Creek" cars became available in 1948. The "River" series cars saw service on other NYC trains until being sold to the B&O in 1956


I left a message for Ron Sebastian at Centralia regarding the letterboards on the New York Central observation cars. The letterboards had PULLMAN, not New York Central, from 1938 until at least May of 1954. The “River” series observations were gone by 1956 – sold to the B&O. If they were ever lettered New York Central, it would have been for only a year or so.
The re-lettering would have occurred on all the sleeper cars as well. I had not brought this up before for the sleeper cars as they continued in service until the PC merger in 1968 with New York Central on the letterboards.
I would just re-letter them without complaint, but there are no PULLMAN decals available in N scale. Same is true for car name decals. None.

Specifically, this is how the lettering was modified for the postwar scheme:
November 1946 - First use of Dark grey body with light grey window band. Pullman cars lettered PULLMAN. Dining cars, coaches and headend cars lettered NEW YORK CENTRAL.
January 1948 - Narrow window band stripes were deleted. Striping and lettering was changed from light gray to aluminum then to imitation silver. Pullman cars were lettered PULLMAN with small NEW YORK CENTRAL at ends.
April 1948 - Car names were reduced in height from 5" to 4".
April 1953 - Black pinstriping around letters, numbers and stripes was deleted.
After May 1954 - Pullman cars began to be lettered NEW YORK CENTRAL with small PULLMAN at ends. Dining cars, coaches and headend cars were lettered NEW YORK CENTRAL.
After June 1958 - Pullman cars were lettered NEW YORK CENTRAL. Dining cars, coaches and headend cars were lettered NEW YORK CENTRAL. 4" car numbers were added to sleeper car sides under the car name.
[Thanks to Terry Link for his excellent summary on his Canada Southern web site]
Modeling the NYC of the early 1950s

bbussey

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 7012
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +997
    • www.bbussey.net
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2010, 04:03:21 PM »
0
Ah, so I suppose they could "close enough" this one:

(1949 with skirts!)

I managed to bag the Kato undec years back, but some J owners out there might be interested.

Is that the Powhatan Arrow?  What is that pulling the consist up front?  Looks like a Pennsy unit.
Bryan Busséy
NHRHTA #2246
NSE #1117
www.bbussey.net


Mark5

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 8966
  • Always with the negative waves Moriarty ...
  • Respect: +170
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2010, 04:06:00 PM »
0
It's the Powhatan Arrow.

That's a N&W J Class 4-8-4 on the front end.

Mark

Puddington

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 3874
  • Gender: Male
  • Modelling is the best medicine for what ails me.
  • Respect: +236
    • The Canadian Pacific Railway's Dominion
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2010, 05:04:50 PM »
0
Ok; now I'm no expert but the Amtrak are totally foobie (and, I'm good with that) because there were NO GN "Port" cars that made it into the BSB scheme, let alone Amtrak silver. I took serious grief from proto cops for this I made from a Kato car........



because the "port" cars got choped and re-tooled into sleepers without the boat tail before the BSB scheme ever came out. The "Port" cars ran on GN's "International" between Seattle and Vancouver B.C.......(and they didn't have skirts either, at least not in any shots I've seen) So; unless someone has a brain wave here those Amtraks are a nifty flight of fancy............
« Last Edit: January 11, 2010, 05:07:42 PM by Puddington »
Model railroading isn't saving my life, but it's providing me moments of joy not normally associated with my current situation..... Train are good!

Mark5

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 8966
  • Always with the negative waves Moriarty ...
  • Respect: +170
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2010, 05:10:46 PM »
0
Port of Seattle:

http://www.greatnorthernempire.net/images/pass_cars/AMTK3770Observation1.JPG

3771 is legit too (as "close enoughs")

Mark

Puddington

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 3874
  • Gender: Male
  • Modelling is the best medicine for what ails me.
  • Respect: +236
    • The Canadian Pacific Railway's Dominion
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2010, 06:26:29 PM »
0
Well then; I stand corrected - and I'm now going to find the so called GN experts that gave me 'what for' for suggesting the existance of the "Port" sleepers in the BSB era (not to say they were ever repainted but still....) and give them a big rassberry - to the search function Robin.............

Sorry Centraila.....my boo boo............but the skirt has to go !
Model railroading isn't saving my life, but it's providing me moments of joy not normally associated with my current situation..... Train are good!

jmlaboda

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 2181
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +162
    • Passenger Car Photo Index
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #11 on: January 12, 2010, 01:34:58 AM »
0
You can add Pinsly ti the list of owners...
http://trainweb.org/passengercars/Indices/BC8.htm#Pinsly

As for a PRR car, you could take either the IM or Kato car, fill the fourth small window from the observation end, the first wide window next to it and the next small window beyond the two wide windows to it to gain more PRR looking car...
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/tr_prr_obsv.jpg
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr8115.jpg

As foobies go it is not a bad car either way.

Nato

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 2056
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +45
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #12 on: January 12, 2010, 02:25:20 AM »
0
    The Two Port Series cars were used by Amtrack, I do not rember if they were simply leased or purchased from BN . I know that several of the Mountain Series cars with their large windows were also used in Amtrack service, leased, in GN Empire Builder colors,they were never painted Sky Blue or BN Green according to my sources.Go to http://www.stnicholismountain.com/History.htm for information on the restoration work on of of these other series cars. I believe one Port series car was destroyed in a wreck in Amtrak service. The cars from the 1947 Empire Builder which went to the Western Star returned to the EB when Great Dome Lounges displaced Mountain Series to the Star,but these KATO -like cars were rebuilt with more rooms and just a small lounge in the round end. They did not last long on the EB after rebuildingas the dome lounge provided more than enough space. All of these cars were rebuilt into coaches,I believe they later ran on NJ Transit and one of them is back at the Minesota Transportation Museum used as a coach. Nate Goodman (Nato). Salt Lake, Utah.

CBQ Fan

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 2259
  • Respect: +89
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2010, 06:43:21 PM »
0
Who would have used the silver Pullman?
Brian

Way of the Zephyr

Mark5

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 8966
  • Always with the negative waves Moriarty ...
  • Respect: +170
Re: 2-1-1 Observation Car
« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2010, 07:21:32 PM »
0
Who would have used the silver Pullman?

If you are referring to the Muskingum River, I believe this represents a Pullman owned car (before the post WW2 divestiture).

Mark