Author Topic: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:  (Read 4974 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Ed Kapuscinski

  • Global Moderator
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 18989
  • Has a degree in American History & Culture.
  • Respect: +2899
    • Conrail 1285
This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« on: June 04, 2007, 11:56:05 AM »
0
But I'm really curious what you all have to say:
http://www.dpreview.com/news/0702/07022203canontx1.asp
  • 10x Stabilized Zoom
  • 7.1mp CCD
  • Compact Size
  • Canon Quality
  • HD Movie Capture Mode

bdeuster

  • Guest
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #1 on: June 04, 2007, 12:08:37 PM »
0
Ed,

This little package has been intriguing me for a couple of weeks. There is just one thing I dont like about it for stills, though. 39-390mm (35 equiv) zoom lens. What most people dont know is that the true "normal" lens in 35 is about 46mm. Hence, 39mm is hardly a wide angle.

B

Ed Kapuscinski

  • Global Moderator
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 18989
  • Has a degree in American History & Culture.
  • Respect: +2899
    • Conrail 1285
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #2 on: June 04, 2007, 12:42:11 PM »
0
I was wondering about that myself.

That's actually one of my gripes about my Fuji Finepix. I don't know what the minimum zoom is, but it does sometimes get in the way.

bdeuster

  • Guest
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #3 on: June 04, 2007, 01:13:49 PM »
0
Ed,

One of the things I really like though is that you can get the lens into a position that mimics the eye of a tall nscale person in a model scene by turning the camera on its side.

The possibilities are quite interesting.

And the idea it does HD in 720p, well that is quite cool!!

B

Ed Kapuscinski

  • Global Moderator
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 18989
  • Has a degree in American History & Culture.
  • Respect: +2899
    • Conrail 1285
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #4 on: June 04, 2007, 01:39:28 PM »
0
Oh yeah, it's the lens position that makes all the difference, you really did make that point to me. That's one of the reasons I've never warmed up the plastic to get a DSLR, actually.

DKS

  • The Pitt
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 12047
  • Dead Man Modeling
  • Respect: +3406
    • David's Modeling Journey
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #5 on: June 04, 2007, 02:03:23 PM »
0
Oh yeah, it's the lens position that makes all the difference, you really did make that point to me. That's one of the reasons I've never warmed up the plastic to get a DSLR, actually.
Actually, FWIW, I've found that the "classic film camera" versatility of a DSLR (using different lenses, extensions and filters, and having manual control over shutter, aperture, etc.) makes up for the bulk that prevents it from achieving "eye-level" shots. For that, I've started messing with a first-surface mirror, placing it on the layout at roughly 45 degrees to the vertical, then shooting straight down at it. So far it seems to work well; the only thing to watch out for is reflecting too much light back into a scene through the mirror. I've also done something with the mirror you can't with a mini-camera--shoot at an upward-facing angle from a scale person's POV, such as at the underside of a bridge. Using a DSLR also allows me to shoot at multiple focal lengths for software merges (Helios, CombineZ), also difficult or impossible with the minis.

The bottom of this Z-scale bridge is only about 2 inches above the ground:

« Last Edit: June 04, 2007, 02:05:03 PM by dks2855 »
“Everyone leaves unfinished business. That's what dying is.” —Amos, The Expanse

John Burkush

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 249
  • Respect: 0
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2007, 04:48:36 PM »
0
But I'm really curious what you all have to say:
http://www.dpreview.com/news/0702/07022203canontx1.asp
  • 10x Stabilized Zoom
  • 7.1mp CCD
  • Compact Size
  • Canon Quality
  • HD Movie Capture Mode
How much ?
It's not available at best buy
DANGER ! DANGER! WILL ROBINSON; MY SENSORS INDICATE THE PRESENCE OF CHROME PLATED WARBONNET SANTA FE
F UNITS ! DANGER ! EXTREME DANGER !

bdeuster

  • Guest
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #7 on: June 04, 2007, 05:02:48 PM »
0
David,

There is no question that the front sided mirror approach is probably the very best way to get the n scale person's eye view, but it most certainly isnt the easiest. Getting a camera two feet out over the layout facing down into the mirror and seeing the image without a live, computer connected visual feed is almost impossible to accomplish (mostly because you cannot see into the viewfinder even with the aid of a right angle finder attachment).

The approach that Ed and I have discussed is for quick and easy with an eye to dramatic composition from many unusual and believable vantage points.

Both Ed and I like to be able to compose quickly and easily by setting the camera directly on the layout. A very small camera helps in this regard!

I am very limited on my layout because I shoot with a Canon 1DS Mark II and it doesnt sit on the layout at all because the lenses tower over everything, so I am restricted to a few "railfanning" spots that I can see from off the layout....

B

DKS

  • The Pitt
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 12047
  • Dead Man Modeling
  • Respect: +3406
    • David's Modeling Journey
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #8 on: June 04, 2007, 05:32:42 PM »
0
David,

There is no question that the front sided mirror approach is probably the very best way to get the n scale person's eye view, but it most certainly isnt the easiest. Getting a camera two feet out over the layout facing down into the mirror and seeing the image without a live, computer connected visual feed is almost impossible to accomplish (mostly because you cannot see into the viewfinder even with the aid of a right angle finder attachment).

The approach that Ed and I have discussed is for quick and easy with an eye to dramatic composition from many unusual and believable vantage points.

Both Ed and I like to be able to compose quickly and easily by setting the camera directly on the layout. A very small camera helps in this regard!

I am very limited on my layout because I shoot with a Canon 1DS Mark II and it doesnt sit on the layout at all because the lenses tower over everything, so I am restricted to a few "railfanning" spots that I can see from off the layout....

B

I wasn't trying to imply that my DSLR techniques were the be-all end-all; merely another approach. True, it's tough working over the middle of a layout with the mirror. I've been working on a jig that supports the camera and mirror on the layout, without need for tripod.

I'll usually position the camera blindly and move it all around in small increments, shooting loads of images--digital film lets you do that. Then I sift through the results looking for ones that work. It's actually kind of fun.

I've used the approach you're talking about as well; I have a pocket-sized Canon that I can sit on the layout for a person-eye view. I find the inability to set focus and exposure controls to be a bit limiting, however. It's good for composing shots to go back and re-shoot with a DSLR.

If I were to start over, I'd do the same again--spend a relatively small amount on a small camera, and save the big bucks for a DSLR with the bells and whistles.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2007, 05:35:57 PM by dks2855 »
“Everyone leaves unfinished business. That's what dying is.” —Amos, The Expanse

wcfn100

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 8057
  • Respect: +719
    • Chicago Great Western Modeler
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #9 on: June 04, 2007, 05:45:33 PM »
0
With a macro focus of 3.9 inches and f-stop of 5.6, I'll wait to see the photos.

How big are your guy's layouts that you need a 10x zoom?!!!


Jason

up1950s

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 9099
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +965
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #10 on: June 04, 2007, 05:49:49 PM »
0
I thought high F numbers were desired for modelers needs , and Super Macro so we can get so close its hard to illuminate the subject were another modeler need . How much is this thing ?

bdeuster

  • Guest
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #11 on: June 04, 2007, 05:52:15 PM »
0
Jason,

By no means do I want to imply that the camera that Ed is talking about is good for taking model photos, just that it looks like the right size and shape. Frankly, there are several specs that might make it a bad camera for this job. And I dont need a 10x zoom for shooting my models.

I am actually interested in the Canon for its "combo" characteristics for a variety of applications, including my travels, but not for shooting my layout, though I would love to see what it can do....

B

John

  • Administrator
  • Crew
  • *****
  • Posts: 11220
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +788
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #12 on: June 04, 2007, 05:53:44 PM »
0
With a macro focus of 3.9 inches and f-stop of 5.6, I'll wait to see the photos.

How big are your guy's layouts that you need a 10x zoom?!!!


Jason

well .. mine is about 24x35 on the wide side ..

bdeuster

  • Guest
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #13 on: June 04, 2007, 06:14:37 PM »
0
Richie,

Actually two of the unknowns on this camera are the minimum (smallest, closed down, as opposed to wide open at f 2.8 or f3.5) aperture and the way the macro works. Many of these types of camera only go to f8 or f11 (rather than f16, f22 or f 32) - not closed down enough in my opinion - and many of these lenses only allow full macro at the widest angle the zoom offers and I prefer to be able to apply the macro at the full zoom as well.

So this camera may suck at taking model photos, but????  I want to see it in action before I draw any final conclusions.

Dont know if this helps but keep asking if it doesnt.

B

edit - BTW, many of these cameras have lenses that only perform well in the middle of the f number range, that is, if the lens has a wide open aperture of 2.8 and a minimum aperture of f11, it may only really be sharp at f5.6 and f 8. And this is one of the failings of point and shoot cameras....
« Last Edit: June 04, 2007, 06:19:08 PM by bdeuster »

pnolan48

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 1731
  • Respect: +74
    • N Scale Ships
Re: This thing MAY be the best modelers camera out there:
« Reply #14 on: June 04, 2007, 06:34:36 PM »
0
I'm still looking for a small camera that I can squeeze into some spots on my layout. For $500, this isn't the one, although the street price may be lower. My daughter's got a Canon S2-IS, a different package at about the same price, and I just don't like it. Lots of flare, limited dynamic range, and nowhere near as sharp as a DSLR. My wife's Sony P&S just doesn't have the controls. I've seen some interesting shots from it in terms of composition, but not something I would show.

However, this is a step in the right direction! You could aways place it upside down! I'm going to experiment with a first surface mirror someday, as I have one tripod that will allow me to suspend the camera over the layout. Not the best solution, admittedly, but it does work.

I am looking for a review--maybe I'll be surprised. If this one doesn't nail it, someone else will soon.