Lowering Micro-Trains depressed-center flat

[Mark5]

I've got a pair in my stash.  Longer wheelbase, lower bolster, no coupler.  Should have checked before I posted about it earlier.

Thanks - 33" wheels?

[rail_nut]

I remember that CN or CP were still using friction bearings for heavy duty flat cars even in the late eighties when I was working for a railway equipment manufacturer. I think it was because they were wider then the available roller bearings but maybe it was the axle diameter. Would that make sense?

[nickelplate759]

Thanks - 33" wheels?

36" wheels.  Wheelbase looks to be about 11'  (The older solid-bearing trucks are about a 9' wheelbase).

[bbussey]

I'm guessing that's this issue in the NSR index:  026 Nov/Dec 2004 40-44 NYC and New Haven Depressed Center Flatcars Bussey, Bryan

Any have a pointer to a digital copy of this article (this was when NSR was still printed)?

@nickelplate759  I thought I might have a PDF approval proof of the article, but it predates Kirk sending final proof PDFs for approval.  I have the PDF of the original submitted Word document still, if that helps.  No pics, but all the text is there along with the photo captions.

I installed NWSL 28" wheelsets back then, but I've since switched to ESM wheelsets on both of my models.

[nickelplate759]

@nickelplate759  I thought I might have a PDF approval proof of the article, but it predates Kirk sending final proof PDFs for approval.  I have the PDF of the original submitted Word document still, if that helps.  No pics, but all the text is there along with the photo captions.

I installed NWSL 28" wheelsets back then, but I've since switched to ESM wheelsets.

@bbussey - sure, I'd be glad to have the text w/o pictures.   I just received ESM 28" wheels in the mail this past weekend for this project
I should have guessed you'd have done this project a while ago.

[nickelplate759]

The trucks on the NKP car are about 2' more inset than the Erie car

According to this diagram, the truck centers are 8'8" from the end beam, truck center-to-center spacing is 41', and the overall car length is 58'4"   Those are almost exactly the measurements of the Micro-Trains car. 

However, looking at the photos of the prototype it's clear that the trucks on the MT car look too close to the drop center.  I can only surmise that the MT drop-center portion is a tad too long for this car, which isn't readily fixable.      So, here's a quandry - do I adjust the truck centers to make it look right, or leave the (surprisingly correct) truck placement alone?  I'm leaning towards the latter.

[Chris333]

I do not have any more photos online, but in the end I use z scale couplers and probably moved the WB as well. I remember cutting clearance with a ball cutter to let the brakes swing.

I did mine so long ago we didn't have sweet a$$ ESM wheelsets back then.

[nickelplate759]

Getting close. 
This is with 28" wheels and filing down the truck bolster.   An unmodified car is on the left, lowered on the right.



I think I can go another .005" to .010" lower with a little more filing and still use the MT 2004 couplers.
Any more than that and I'll have to machine out the chassis to set the coupler box into it, which is what I suspect @bbussey did.

[bbussey]

I would move the bolsters for two reasons.  One, the model looks like a trolley car because the bolsters are too far inset for the model.  Two, you will need to move the bolsters so the trucks clear the depressed slope regardless of whether you're using the Commonwealth trucks or the Buckeye trucks.  And yes I used #2004 offset shank couplers screwed directly to the zinc frame, I did not have to mill out a cavity.  One of the stirrups is further inset to the coupler.  I had to remove the break shoe on that corner of the Commonwealth truck as there was no way to make it clear the stirrup.  It's not noticeable because the truck is behind the stirrup.  The Buckeye truck did not need modification (I built a NH car and a PC ex-NYC car).

I filed the zinc bolsters off completely.  The hump in the bolster beam is sufficient for the truck frame to clear the underside of the deck, and it sets the deck top at the proper height.  I also drilled through all the deck holes and the slots on the slopes so they are fully see-through, which is a vast visual improvement.  Easy to do if you clamp the zinc frame in a vise.

[mmagliaro]

I think it's starting to look really good.  But man oh man, now I'd REALLY move those trucks outward.  The lower the car gets, the closer to the truck that depressed "S" part gets, and more it emphasizes the odd look of the trucks being so inboard.

[nickelplate759]

I'm torn on moving the trucks.  Yes, the do look a little odd where they are, but based on the NKP equipment diagram they're in precisely the correct place.   It's the drop center that's a little too long (and too thick).      I wonder if adding the clearance notch above the center axle would help the appearance enough to make the trucks look less awkward.

[garethashenden]

Do you only have a wheelbase dimension? Is there a dimension for the coupler to bolster length? I would be inclined to get that one right. If the center is too long, chances are the overall car is too. But if the ends look right one is less likely to notice an extra couple of feet in the well. Whereas the truck position looks odd at present.

Edit: I scrolled up and see the diagram. I would concentrate on getting the 8’8” dimension correct and ignore the 41’ one. Unless you want to start cutting up the car, but that’s a much bigger project that probably isn’t worth it.

[nickelplate759]

Do you only have a wheelbase dimension? Is there a dimension for the coupler to bolster length? I would be inclined to get that one right. If the center is too long, chances are the overall car is too. But if the ends look right one is less likely to notice an extra couple of feet in the well. Whereas the truck position looks odd at present.

Edit: I scrolled up and see the diagram. I would concentrate on getting the 8’8” dimension correct and ignore the 41’ one. Unless you want to start cutting up the car, but that’s a much bigger project that probably isn’t worth it.

That's just it - both the 8'8" dimension and the 41' dimension are pretty much spot on, as is the overall car length.

[Lemosteam]

 At this point George I would go proportion over fidelity, knowing that dimensional fidelity is impossible.  Move the truck so that it LOOKS proportionally correct, i.e. visually equal to the drawing at each end. Visually match the gap to the frame drop and visually match the distance from the end of the truck to the end beam and move the hole to the truck center.

No one but you will know the overall wheelbase.

[Missaberoad]

One thing to keep in mind is the prototype GSC depressed center flats had the trucks inboard,
and the "weird" looking overhangs. If you are modeling a GSC car it is correct.