T-Trak T-TRAK Wiring for DCC Both Tracks

[ridinshotgun]

I made a drawing to explain the basic theory.

(Attachment Link)

Just an FYI but KATO has discontinued the hard plastic 3 way extensions 24-827.  They replaced them with 24-833, which is basically just 3 daisy chained female plugs and one male connector. I also believe the cord is shorter now too.

Which brings up another issue of a standard being dependent on one manufacturer for a critical standard part.  Here they at least are providing a similar replacement but what happens if a manufacturer decides not to?

[Dave V]

I made a drawing to explain the basic theory.

(Attachment Link)

Yeah, this is what I had in mind. Sweet!

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Just an FYI but KATO has discontinued the hard plastic 3 way extensions 24-827.  They replaced them with 24-833, which is basically just 3 daisy chained female plugs and one male connector. I also believe the cord is shorter now too.

Interesting! I don't know how I feel about that. I THINK I like it, although the shorter cord sucks.

Which brings up another issue of a standard being dependent on one manufacturer for a critical standard part.  Here they at least are providing a similar replacement but what happens if a manufacturer decides not to?

I don't want to think about that.

[ridinshotgun]

I don't want to think about that.

Remember cinch jones plugs that were the standard in n-trak?  I do and that is why n-trak went to power poles.  The cinch jones plugs dried up when the manufacturer discontinued the style used by n-trak.

[squirrelhunter]

I made a drawing to explain the basic theory.

Thank you Ed! The power poles would be in the points marked A and B on the diagram.

[Maletrain]

Kato did discontinue the blue box 3-way splitters for their track power cables, replacing them with effectively the same 3-way splitter that does not have the splice inside a blue box.

But, then they went with a 5-way splitter that I find even more practical for making T-Trak bus segments that will connect to individual modules.  see https://modeltrainstuff.com/products/kato-28930-5-way-extension-cord-30cm

I have not bothered to price out how much it would cost to make the bus segments with all Power Pole connectors to the individual modules.  But, considering the costs of the rest of the hobby, I don't think the difference in cost is really important.

I think what is important is that the people who make modules are not faced with a need for using components they don't get at hobby shops or most on-line retailers, and which require a rather costly special crimper.

And, as for the supplier going out of business, I doubt that Anderson is guaranteed to exist forever, and the "clones" of their parts have serious compatibility issues.

So, yes, Power Poles are "neato", but forcing everybody to use them everywhere for T-Trak seems like a step back from the underlying philosophy of a bunch of people being able to get together just about anywhere and use simple modules to create a pop-up layout, run it for an evening or a day or two, then break it down easily and go home.

I do understand that it takes additional work and planning to put together a Guinness Book of Records T-Trak setup, but I still think you can do that with Kato connectors on the individual modules.

Regarding the worry about the "jack wagon [that] can treat my track feeder wires like a silver back ape with a fresh banana, straining the connectors", I would be more worried about the actual scenery on my modules than the connectors if we start hiring such "help".  And, I have spent considerable time fixing the Power Pole bus connectors on the N-Trak modules at my Club, which did suffer pullouts of the crimped wires from apparently very rough and probably ignorant "helpers".   So, even the Power Poles are not "silverback proof".  What is really needed is some strain relief on the wires under the modules before they get to the track where it is hard to make new connections once things are scenicked.

[Five-O-Eight]

We use a mix in our group up here in the Puget Sound area. We have come to the conclusion that the Anderson Power Pole connectors are far superior to the Kato/Molex plugs when it comes to reliability. There is a section of older modules that we group together because they do use the older system, and we tend to have the most issues with power drops in that area of any given setup.

Cables get built in a Y configuration so that the next link down the chain gets covered for power. Wires in the cables are usually 14ga stranded as opposed to the 22ga of a normal Kato feeder wire. I developed a 3D resin printable housing mount that simply mounts in a hole in the back of a module. It was designed such that it is retained by a 3D printable clip. If there is interest I will be happy to explain further.

I do not feel that Power Poles constitute a barrier to entry any more than any other aspect of our hobby. They are simply a different way of managing power distribution that is more robust than the Molex connectors, and has a better current carrying capacity due to the use of larger gauge wire. I personally do not understand why we would insist on using smaller gauge wires simply to stay with a system of connectors. We use 12ga wires on DCC buses on home layouts then want to use 22ga on a large T-Trak setup?

[ridinshotgun]

I think what is important is that the people who make modules are not faced with a need for using components they don't get at hobby shops or most on-line retailers, and which require a rather costly special crimper.

And, as for the supplier going out of business, I doubt that Anderson is guaranteed to exist forever, and the "clones" of their parts have serious compatibility issues.

So, yes, Power Poles are "neato", but forcing everybody to use them everywhere for T-Trak seems like a step back from the underlying philosophy of a bunch of people being able to get together just about anywhere and use simple modules to create a pop-up layout, run it for an evening or a day or two, then break it down easily and go home.

I do understand that it takes additional work and planning to put together a Guinness Book of Records T-Trak setup, but I still think you can do that with Kato connectors on the individual modules.

Regarding the worry about the "jack wagon [that] can treat my track feeder wires like a silver back ape with a fresh banana, straining the connectors", I would be more worried about the actual scenery on my modules than the connectors if we start hiring such "help".  And, I have spent considerable time fixing the Power Pole bus connectors on the N-Trak modules at my Club, which did suffer pullouts of the crimped wires from apparently very rough and probably ignorant "helpers".   So, even the Power Poles are not "silverback proof".  What is really needed is some strain relief on the wires under the modules before they get to the track where it is hard to make new connections once things are scenicked.

If you read the t-trak standards anderson power poles are already REQUIRED in the bus connections so anyone setting up more than one module should already have them in supply. I can get them shipped to me from powerwerx just as quick as any Kato parts and most instance quicker since most online hobby shops take forever to ship stuff if they even have it in stock, which as evidenced in another thread here they usually don't. 

And who is this everyone that is requiring people to use the power pole connections unless part of an organized club that sets up with limited outside modules. So what is the argument there again about who is requiring power poles?  And for the record those "guinesss book records" use power busses with kato connectors at the modules but power poles elsewhere as called for in the standard.  How many organized T-trak set up have you now been part of that have required power poles?

Anderson power poles aren't going anywhere anytime soon.  They are in immense use outside of our little section of the hobby, from high voltage applications down to the little 15 amp connectors we use.

I mean really what difference does it make if someone uses them or not at the modules?  We have already established that there isn't any "requirement". I get it you don't like them but the plenty sure do.  Most of the problems that do arise with power poles are almost exclusively user generated from grabbing the wire to disconnect, failing to use crimpers correctly, using the wrong size interior connector, to soldering the wire ends before crimping (which Anderson says expressly not to do since it creates a weak crimp.)

[Maletrain]

"I mean really what difference does it make if someone uses them or not at the modules?  We have already established that there isn't any 'requirement'."

The only problem I see would be somebody who makes a module with the established standard of Kato connectors and finds that it won't connect to some other "club standard" that insists on Power Pole connectors to an individual module.  I don't think anybody is arguing that Power Pole connectors should not be used for buses.  But, for small, simple setups, they are certainly overkill.  Having Kato connectors to individual modules allows small setups with only Kato stuff, yet allows inclusion of the same module in huge setups that run long, large wire buses with their segments connected by Power Poles but the individual modules still connecting to those buses with Kato connectors.

"I get it you don't like them but the plenty sure do."

I did not say that I don't like them.  I do use them.  I have the crimper and colors of white, blue, yellow, red and black with all 3 sizes of crimp-on contacts.  They are the standard for bus connections.  But, if your home layout is 2 end caps with 4 feet of straight modules between them, the Power Poles are definitely overkill engineering.  If you love to use them, go ahead.  I just think that their uses should not make modules that are compatible with the established standard become incompatible with some group's layout using some sort of "enhanced" standard.

[arbomambo]

First,
Please refer to the actual T-TRAK standards.
You can find them here:
https://nrail.org/T-TRAK-Standards
Or here:
https://nationalt-traklayout.com/t-trak-standards

The Kato connector is THE T-TRAK STANDARD interface for the red and yellow track feed drops from the module to the bus! There is no ‘official’ movement to change the module-to-bus wiring from Kato connectors to Power Pole connectors.
That being said, there are many groups (and individuals) who choose to use Power Poles as their module track feed connector; obviously their bus sections also feature Power Pole drops to allow connection. This is a personal club choice and not T-TRAK standard.
I, myself, build ALL of my modules with Power Pole cluster interfaces in the rear fascia for the same reason someone above mentioned- tidiness, ease of transport and storage, and reduced possibility of damaging the module-to-bus feeds.





HOWEVER, in order to be in compliance with T-TRAK standards, and to allow my modules to plug into T-TRAK standards bus (which features Kato connector drops -either the 3-way or newer 5-way), AND any bus that may only feature Power Pole drops (maximum flexibility and a desire to be able to ‘play well’ with any situation that presents itself), I construct Power Pole-to-Kato connector pigtails for every module (each is stored up under the module so as to allow it to store and travel with the module.







As stated in previous posts, Standard T-TRAK bus features Kato drops for module interface (either the 3-way or the newer 5-way).
There is no official standard on the length of T-TRAK bus. I used to build 10-12’ sections of bus with Kato 3-way drops spliced into the bus every 3’ or so. I now build much shorter sections of bus, including 1/2’ or 1’ sections featuring a Kato 3-way or 5-way drops for each line (red and yellow). These allow me to plug these sections into the bus line anywhere more module connections may be needed.
Example of a 4’ sections featuring of T-TRAK bus:



An example of a short, 1’ section of T-TRAK bus (this one features a DPDT switch that reverses polarity on yellow line along this section and any further bus connected down the line):




Anderson Power Pole connectors ARE the T-TRAK standard for T-TRAK power-to-bus and bus-to-bus connections!
Again, this is found in the T-TRAK standards document linked above.
The Power Pole clusters must be constructed (for both types of T-TRAK standard power bus configs -Yes, there are two accepted T-TRAK standards document bus configs; what I call single line (blue/white) and double line (red/yellow), so that there is a ‘male’ end and a ‘female’ end. This allows bus to be continuously lengthened according to the size of the layout. The Power supply always features a ‘female’ interface, to which the ‘male’ end of a power bus connects…
Here is an example (taken from the T-TRAK standards document) showing the Power Pole cluster configurations on both types of bus:







Oh, and btw, there is a guy on Facebook who 3D prints boxes (in red and yellow) for the new ‘naked’ Kato 3-way and 5-way drops.





He can be found on the T-TRAK group pages on Facebook

[peteski]

Great setup Bruce!  You sure make the job of a layout coordinator easy.

[Maletrain]

That is a really nice, intuitive setup, Bruce.  It takes effort to produce those, but I expect it saves a lot of headaches when they are employed in large T-Trak setups.  Thanks for the leadership.

[robert3985]

Although I have practically zero interest in ever building/setting-up anything to do with T-Trak, I was quite impressed with @arbomambo 's very nicely done and verrry clear photos/explanation of what the T-Trak wiring specifications are.

The commitment to the T-Trak modular format is very evident, and I am sure there are many modelers who ARE interested in it who will use your post for future reference, thanking you mentally for a long time...including the OP.

Well done indeed and thanks for the time & effort!

Cheerio!
Bob Gilmore

[Ed Kapuscinski]

First,
Please refer to the actual T-TRAK standards.
You can find them here:
https://nrail.org/T-TRAK-Standards
Or here:
https://nationalt-traklayout.com/t-trak-standards

...

Bruce, this is EXCELLENT, thank you!

[Dave V]

Agreed on all counts. Trying to decide if I want to go full-bore fancy like Bruce's example...it'll be easier to do before the modules are fully detailed!

Where are folks getting the yellow PowerPole connectors? I'm seeing only black and red on Amazon.