Atlas Code 55 Flex Corrosion: Lets Talk About That

[Bill H]

Ed:
None of our business where you bought that latest batch, but could it have been mishandled by the seller, perhaps by accident, unintentionally? And thus the issue is not a manufacturing issue, but a prior owner handling issue?
 
Kind regards,
Bill

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Ed:
None of our business where you bought that latest batch, but could it have been mishandled by the seller, perhaps by accident, unintentionally? And thus the issue is not a manufacturing issue, but a prior owner handling issue?
 
Kind regards,
Bill

It's possible. I'm asking about the issue to hopefully get a handle on if it's a widespread issue or if it's just me.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Ok! Experiment in progress.

One stick of ancient track (some of Jerry's old stock) and one stick of new stuff.

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[Ed Kapuscinski]

Ok, preliminary results:

Leaving those both in the vinegar has yielded no corrosion on either.

However, I'm not 100% sure the "new" piece was from the affected batch (the only way I can tell is where it's sitting in my bundle of "new" track).

I'm going to try applying some vinegar to the track on the layout that does display the corrosion to see if it triggers more.

Stay tuned.

[cgw]

take one of your track sections- glue it down - apply ballast to the track -apply scenic cement  the hook it up to your command station apply power.    Usually this will get your patina in the ballast.     if the water has enough ionic content in it with a potential field.  the electrons begin to flow and the copper will begin to form oxides.  you will get you patina.....     Green patina is when you have some sulfur compounds present,    Blue patina if there is ammonia,   and brown if there are organic acids.      Take your vinegar solution and add some table salt it will begin to corrode.    Basic chemistry in very simple terms.

4Cu + O2 → 2Cu2O [red to pink]
2Cu2O + O2 → 4CuO
Cu + S → CuS
2CuO + CO2 + H2O → Cu2CO3(OH)2 [“malachite,” dark green to blue]
3CuO + 2CO2 + H2O → Cu3(CO3)2(OH)2 [“azurite,” blue to purple]
4CuO + SO3 + 3H2O → Cu4SO4(OH)6 [“brochantite,” dark green to emerald]

trivia:
human blood is red color is a result of the iron/oxygen
Crabs have greenish-blue blood  because the metal compound that carries the oxygen in their bodies is copper.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Interesting.

I'll try my vinegar thing again and apply some juice to see if that does anything.

[OldEastRR]

Waiting for the next episode of of "Cookin' with Kapuscinski: Basted Atlas Flex". Yum! 

[Dupesy]

I've gone through almost 3 cases of Atlas C55 flex on my new layout.  I did find a couple pieces that had some spots of corrosion right out of the box, I used those strips for smaller pieces and cut the corrosion out.  I haven't seen any new corrosion appear on the track I've laid; most of it has been down for a year or slightly longer.

[Bill H]

Ed:
My mainline is entirely 100% ME code 40, but I was building a 15 track computerized sliding staging table for the layout and needed track right away. ME was not in production for Code 40. So I bought a full sealed unopened box of Atlas code 55 flex for the staging table from my supplier. I just manually checked each piece with an Optivisor for corrosion or anything out of the ordinary. Nothing. Note, that box was still factory air until I opened it.

Kind regards,
Bill

[Angus Shops]

I have Atlas 55 staging yards at both ends of my layout. Unballasted and unpainted - I do see a couple of dark patches, more like darkening of the otherwise bright silver finish, on the lower portions of the rail but nothing more.

[Bill H]

Ed:
While searching for something else, I stumbled into this discussion re oxidation or something as you were trying out a different ballast.

https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=58072.0

By any chance, is this the same track work from spring last year after however you remediated the original problem?

Kind regards,
Bill

[JoeD]

looks like you've been spilling your Mountain Whiskey on the track... 

Joe

[mark.hinds]

So is this galvanic corrosion? 

I am looking at the following table of galvanic indices:  https://www.azom.com/article.aspx?ArticleID=11833

Apparently nickel-silver is something like 60% copper, 20% nickel, and 20% zinc.  Although I don't see this on the above table, perhaps it is approximated by the fifth line "German silvery high copper-nickel alloys"?  If so, what is the other metal; is it something in the ballast?  The article says "In what is considered to be a "normal" environment (storage places; warehouses; humidity-controlled areas) there should not be a potential difference of more than ~0.25V, otherwise galvanic corrosion can occur."  So any difference in galvanic index over .25V between the nickel-silver and the other metal would apparently be bad.  EDIT:  Then on top of that, we have the train control voltage, presumably worse with DCC than DC. 

MH

[Maletrain]

Ed, Try taking your track test pieces out of the vinegar and letting then air dry without washing them off.  I say that because I use vinegar to clean brass - it removes corrosion while immersed.  But, I need to wash it afterwards.  If you leave it in enough vinegar long enough, you can completely dissolve brass, with it looking shiny as it disappears.

I have noticed that using white glue in hopper "loads" to secure nails for magnetic removability does quickly rust the nails (overnight).  So, I am wondering why gluing down ballast with diluted while glue does not likewise corrode rails.   But, it has been my experience that it does not - at least not as badly as your pictures show.

[nkalanaga]

Probably because whatever is reacting with the iron in the nails doesn't affect copper, zinc, and nickel the same way.

Many years ago I made the mistake of using Florida beach sand for ballast on a diorama.  Within a year or two the Micro-Engineering (then Railcraft) spikes dissolved completely.  Even after rinsing the sand there was enough salt left in it to be dangerous.  The nickel-silver rail looked the same as ever.  Not surprising, as wooden ship builders used copper and bronze for any fittings, instead of rust-prone iron and steel.