1/2 off TCS CN decoders

[daniel_leavitt2000]

https://www.tcsdcc.com/n-scale

$30 Each is not a bad price at all. I ordered a few but may need to stock up if these are going to be discontinued. I still have something like 100 engines to convert.

[John]

https://www.tcsdcc.com/n-scale

$30 Each is not a bad price at all. I ordered a few but may need to stock up if these are going to be discontinued. I still have something like 100 engines to convert.

Not to be second guessing.  But will you run all these 100 engines enough to justify $3000+ in decoders.   

I have a little over 50, and struggled to run them all enough to make it worth while

[peteski]

For similar price I would go for ESUs.  Motor control and lighting effects superior to TCS.  TCS pricing has always been fairly high (higher than Digitrax).

For example here is a LokPilot5 micro for $30.  It is likely smaller than any of the TCS decoders,.
https://sbs4dcc.com/products/esu-59826-lokpilot-5-micro-nmra-dcc-decoder-nem651-6-pin-wired-plug.html

[C855B]

For similar price I would go for ESUs.  Motor control and lighting effects superior to TCS.  TCS pricing has always been fairly high (higher than Digitrax).

Both useful articles, but hardly interchangeable. --Col. Sherman T. Potter, M*A*S*H

The CN is designed to be semi-drop-in for early Atlas, Lifelike and Kato hood units. Saves a boatload of hacking. ESU has no equivalent.

I have a mix of TCS and ESU on the layout. The TCS decoders I don't need to do much other than program the road number. ESU I have to adjust momentum parms so they play nicely with TCS.

[peteski]

No hacking? That's true Mike.
The ESU decoder is likely smaller than just one of the CN decoder's boards, but yes, some "hacking" would be required. 

Funny thing is that as I'm typing this I'm watching an episode of M.A.S.H (with Col. Sherman T. Potter).  That show is such a classic.

[CRL]

After much research & consideration, I’ve decided I’m too old a dog to learn & implement DCC. I know & understand conventional DC wiring & control systems very well and despite the many operational advantages of DCC, I cannot justify the added expense of implementing a DCC system with my equipment.

[jagged ben]

Man, those things used to be $35 etail.  Do they still have the bluish-white LEDs?

[jagged ben]

No hacking? That's true Mike.
The ESU decoder is likely smaller than just one of the CN decoder's boards, but yes, some "hacking" would be required. 

Funny thing is that as I'm typing this I'm watching an episode of M.A.S.H (with Col. Sherman T. Potter).  That show is such a classic.

Some hacking was required for the CN and CN-GP decoders I did years ago.  Kato SD40/45 and U30C.  Looked at a Atlas Classic GP35 the other day that would definitely also require it.

[peteski]

I have a mix of TCS and ESU on the layout. The TCS decoders I don't need to do much other than program the road number. ESU I have to adjust momentum parms so they play nicely with TCS.

Isn't the default  momentum (CV3 and 4) set to zero (no momentum)  in both brands? 

[C855B]

Isn't the default  momentum (CV3 and 4) set to zero (no momentum)  in both brands?

No. I don't recall offhand about TCS (might be 0, or 1), the LokPilot 5 Nanos I've been installing have all been at 11, and even 0 has some manner of ramped startup. I'm sure I don't have all ducks straightened out with the Nanos, but right now consists with a mix of TCS and ESU seem to have mild disagreements when stepping off.

[peteski]

No. I don't recall offhand about TCS (might be 0, or 1), the LokPilot 5 Nanos I've been installing have all been at 11, and even 0 has some manner of ramped startup. I'm sure I don't have all ducks straightened out with the Nanos, but right now consists with a mix of TCS and ESU seem to have mild disagreements when stepping off.

Well, Mike's correct.  I actually RTFM'd LokPilot 5 manual, and the default settings there show CV3=28 and CV4=21!!  I don't remember them being that high.  I'll have to read one of my virgin decoders.  But then again the ESU's documentation is sometimes not very accurate.

Then the LokSound5 also have 2 startup delays, but I thought LokPilot would have those disabled. 

[jagged ben]

Is there a standard for the effect of those CVs that someone doesn't follow?  I know that Digitrax and ESU aren't the same.  Is TCS the same as either of them?

[peteski]

Is there a standard for the effect of those CVs that someone doesn't follow?  I know that Digitrax and ESU aren't the same.  Is TCS the same as either of them?

Looking at NMRA DCC specs ( https://dccwiki.com/Configuration_Variable/Indexed_Configuration_Variables ) no defaults are given for those CVs.

[daniel_leavitt2000]

I'm not sure if I'll ever use any of my engines, but I do like to tinker, so I'm about 50% the way though DCC conversions.

These TCS decoders are really good for older Kato, Atlas and LL engines. I just added a TCS CN to a custom Guilford C424 today. These decoders have several benefits:
1. Minor to no milling of the frame to make them fit.
2. Soldering is greatly reduced.
3. The wires are thin enough to sit between the frame halves and not on top. This really helps with close clearance installs.
4. The decoder doesn't need plastic wrap like most wired decoders.

Number 3 is why I used this decoder on the C424. That shell is a very tight fit to begin with. I find TCS are very good out of the box. ESU has some features turned on that I do not like. I use mostly NCE decoders as they are fairly easy to program and perform well once done.

Topic drift...
I'm experimenting with other decoders. I been using a few wired NCE N12SR boards with the casing stripped off. The wire is far too thick though. Like many decoders, you need to add resistors to use LEDs. I plan on getting a hot air rework station to replace the on board shunts with 1000 ohm SMD resistors and use wired 0402 LEDs for headlights. The rest of the wires will be replaced with ESU 36 AWG wire. This should allow these boards to be used in almost any engine without milling.

[Sumner]

I been using a few wired NCE N12SR boards with the casing stripped off. The wire is far too thick though. Like many decoders, you need to add resistors to use LEDs. I plan on getting a hot air rework station to replace the on board shunts with 1000 ohm SMD resistors and use wired 0402 LEDs for headlights. The rest of the wires will be replaced with ESU 36 AWG wire. This should allow these boards to be used in almost any engine without milling.

Good to try alternatives, I'm always doing it myself but if the size I found (don't have one) for the  N12SR is ( .34" x 0.7" x 0.12" 8.6 x 18 x 3.2 mm) there are for sure other alternatives out there in the same price range ($30-$35).



It does have 4 functions, two more than the two Digitrax shown there but also $10 or so more if you don't need the additional two.  Like a number of others I've really become a big fan of ESU and pretty much only buy the LokPilots or LokSounds.  I bought a few Zimo but haven't used them yet saving them for some installs where I need the smallest possible decoder.  I think the LokPilots hit a sweet spot of size and functions you get for the buck and they just work well.

I looked at the CN and CN-GP decoders when I started but there was a big price difference in the $16 digitrax I could use for engines where my only concern was could they run DCC.  In a few minutes I could convert the light boards for power pickup and their LEDs and use them or an even smaller easy to make lightboard and a ...





.... $16 decoder or a $12 Lais (when you could find them) decoder.

TCS's current half price sale at $30 does make them more affordable if one wants to go that route.

Sumner