Author Topic: Intermountain/CCS Diners  (Read 2760 times)

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apudelek

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Intermountain/CCS Diners
« on: April 22, 2022, 10:58:40 PM »
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Saw this on the 'Bay tonight.  Anybody pick one up yet?  For an SPF like me it might be a nice foob D85.  I want to say it's a NYC prototype though.

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Andrew

The Gotham Union Terminal Co.

Modeling the Passenger Operations of the PRR & NH in Electrified Territory

thomasjmdavis

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2022, 09:30:02 AM »
+1
For what it's worth, the IMRC website currently (as of 30 seconds ago) shows them as "shipping this month", and not in the "arrived" section of their retail operation- and I haven't seen any show up yet at the couple of online retailers I follow. So they may still be on the water, eBay sellers notwithstanding. And, now that I've said that, they could show up on retail shelves on Monday.

https://irctrains.com/collections/just-arrived/Just-Arrived

From what I've read on RW and in the modeling press, you are correct about the NYC prototype, and photos back that up.
But, if it were me, I would check with some of the discount online hobby shops (or just the local HS, if you are lucky enough to have one) for when they have some coming in, and save something off of the MSRP and all the eBay hassle.

Tom D.

If you don't know what it is, don't throw it out.

Bart1701

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2022, 10:50:42 AM »
+2
I had ordered one from Fifer Hobbies, and they sent me an email this week letting me know that they should have them around the end of April / early May.

Bart

Ed Kapuscinski

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2022, 09:22:23 AM »
+1
I just saw them pop up (sans photos) at MBK.

apudelek

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2022, 10:21:25 AM »
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Ugh, I still have to shill out for a P5a or two...  Gonna be a rough year for the poor wallet with all of this Centralia varnish coming this summer.  I need another of the 13DBRs and another 18RMT...  Plus eyeing two of these!


Andrew

The Gotham Union Terminal Co.

Modeling the Passenger Operations of the PRR & NH in Electrified Territory

randgust

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2022, 11:58:24 AM »
+1
I've got one coming....hopefully.

I'll be darned though, if I can determine the prototypes (other than NYC) and builder for the Centralia car   It 'sorta' looks right, close enough, to the UP ACF car, if you modify the exhaust stacks and add the radio antenna across the roof.   There should be a plan type somewhere.

That got me going though, back to my original summer 1972 trip notes 50 years ago (age 15), when I didn't realize that window car numbers were not the real car numbers.    I should have taken better consist notes, but the UP diner on the Amtrak Chief was apparently one of six ACF UP-4800 series cars leased by Amtrak,  and not actually purchased (or repainted) by Amtrak until October of 72.   The Amtrak rainbow era is alive and well on my layout.

The 1972 Amtrak Car Spotters Guide didn't list any of them on the Amtrak roster as they were still leased, an interesting gotcha.   The other surprise in that book is just how few non-Budd cars are listed in it, across the board, even though the rainbow era had all kinds of smooth-side cars in it.  I remember the eastbound Zephyr as just a riot of oddball color, and behind SP, UP, and Burlington painted power.  These ex-UP diners lasted on Amtrak through the early 80's and a surprising number are still out there now in various hands, either direct from UP or via Amtrak.

Sokramiketes

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2022, 04:52:58 PM »
+1
I've got one coming....hopefully.

I'll be darned though, if I can determine the prototypes (other than NYC) and builder for the Centralia car   It 'sorta' looks right, close enough, to the UP ACF car, if you modify the exhaust stacks and add the radio antenna across the roof.   There should be a plan type somewhere.


Right, Eastern one is NYC, the Western one is an SP prototype. 

kscessandriver

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #7 on: April 28, 2022, 05:42:16 PM »
+1
Well I ordered 4. Could have got by with 2 (both Empire Builders), but 2 were for trains I might someday build. Still looking for 1 more.

randgust

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #8 on: May 09, 2022, 09:11:07 AM »
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OK, got my UP (eastern) diner and finally had a chance to really evaluate it.  It's been a long wait.

Unlike a lot of the Centralia/Intermountain stuff, this one is not glue together in an immovable mass.

The trucks are MT, not body mount, with metal wheels - not sure whose - but low-profile and have no initial issues on my layout.

The entire underframe snaps in, with a metal weight between the frame and the interior casting.   The interior casting snaps in.

The lighting is interesting.   I expected to see a Rapido easy-peasy in there, this is similar, but rather built into the car roof.   It comes with a magnet 'kit' to trigger the reed switch, which is on one end (not in the middle) of the car.   When I got it, I had no response off the lights, which is why I tore it apart to find out how it was assembled.   I found the lights were a very green LED, and very dim.   I ended up replacing the batteries, which solved the problem, but to replace the batteries you have to unclip the roof, take out a tiny screw to lift the electronics board, and then you can get at them.   And that solved the lighting problem.

The diaphragms looks to be American Models ones.   I have to give them credit, they used the 'best of breed' for the trucks, couplers, wheels, design factors, etc.    The paint and finish is excellent.  Underbody detail is excellent too.  The green LED cast is not objectionable in use.  Overall, I'd give it a 9.5 of 10 here, the only deduction is for semi-dead batteries.  The design engineering in this is really impressive.   And the annoyance of glued-up Intermountain locomotive shells has not carried into these.

For the UP 9400 class, I have to add some more roof detail like the Kato, but I'll get to it.   Considering that I've been VERY disappointed in some of the recent equipment offerings (particularly for operating issues)  and turned around and just resold them, this was a pleasant surprise.  Not a cheap car, but in the end, I'd say 'worth it' and recommend. 

thomasjmdavis

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #9 on: May 09, 2022, 09:57:33 AM »
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Unlike a lot of the Centralia/Intermountain stuff, this one is not glue together in an immovable mass.

The trucks are MT, not body mount, with metal wheels - not sure whose - but low-profile and have no initial issues on my layout.

The entire underframe snaps in, with a metal weight between the frame and the interior casting.   The interior casting snaps in.

The lighting is interesting.   I expected to see a Rapido easy-peasy in there, this is similar, but rather built into the car roof.   It comes with a magnet 'kit' to trigger the reed switch, which is on one end (not in the middle) of the car.   When I got it, I had no response off the lights, which is why I tore it apart to find out how it was assembled.   I found the lights were a very green LED, and very dim.   I ended up replacing the batteries, which solved the problem, but to replace the batteries you have to unclip the roof, take out a tiny screw to lift the electronics board, and then you can get at them.   And that solved the lighting problem.


Are the metal wheels perhaps the Intermountain 34.5 scale inch wheels?  My recollection is that the MT 1017 truck requires some modification (scraping out some plastic) to get a 36" wheel to fit.  Plus the marketing relationship between Intermountain and CCS.  Glad to hear that they have moved on from the original Des Plaines kit design to something that lends itself to disassembly- or at least a roof that is remove-able without breaking glue joints. Diners stand out in a train, and it's good to know there are a couple more viable options out there for modelers in addition to the Kato smoothside UP diner and the venerable backwards Con-cor.

On a side note....I do wish that manufacturers who make interiors for their cars would run a few extra for those of us with kit built, kitbashed or just old cars with no interiors or crappy interiors (like the Con Cor diners that came with coach seats).  I know, I know....there are a dozen reasons they don't do this....but I would be a likely customer if they did.
Tom D.

If you don't know what it is, don't throw it out.

randgust

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #10 on: May 09, 2022, 01:25:46 PM »
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Yeah, I'm going to paint the interior and get the tabletops white, add some passengers at least torsos.   The car lights are good enough that at least at night, the car looks darn empty.   I already had my daughter-in-law bust on me for that one that my trains were empty.

I remember the UP diner interior as being somewhat bland, nothing remarkable.   But the ex-Burlington dome lounge was a theme car, cowboy and western details, I wish I'd recorded the car name.   Judging from the photos of the Amtrak Chief in '72, a dome was not standard equipment, and neither was that UP diner.

The most noticeable missing details are the roof radio antenna and the larger stacks above the grill area.   Those are really noticeable.  The original Kato smooth-side diner got that right, but finding one of those proved impossible.

Edit 5-20:  Finally got a chance to run the car, and run it hard, over my entire layout mid train mixed with multiple Kato cars.   Mostly a wheel and truck travel issue, glad to report test running was flawless, and 'most' of my hidden trackage and storage yard is decades-old Atlas C80 4's and 6's with 11" curves, so it's not automatic that stuff works with everything and a lot of new equipment has flunked.   No problems here.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2022, 09:08:52 AM by randgust »

Cajonpassfan

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #11 on: May 24, 2022, 08:34:37 PM »
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Right, Eastern one is NYC, the Western one is an SP prototype.

Hmm, thanks. So when were the two prototypes built and how are they different? I see @thomasjmdavis used the eastern version for his UP car. I'm tempted to get the TTG SP version (it's gorgeous) for occasional use on a UP secondary train, but think it maybe too modern for my pre-52' era?
Thoughts appreciated,
Otto

thomasjmdavis

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #12 on: May 24, 2022, 10:19:31 PM »
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Hmm, thanks. So when were the two prototypes built and how are they different? I see @thomasjmdavis used the eastern version for his UP car. I'm tempted to get the TTG SP version (it's gorgeous) for occasional use on a UP secondary train, but think it maybe too modern for my pre-52' era?
Thoughts appreciated,
Otto
I don't have one. I think maybe you were reading Randgust post up above.

But...if it is what I think it is...the SP (ie "Western") car is a plan 7579a built in 1949.  That said, caveat emptor- I am NOT an expert on SP, but it does seem to match the Union Station products sides.
https://unionstationproducts.com/southern-pacific/-7579a-sp-ps-smooth-side-48-seat-diner.html
Tom D.

If you don't know what it is, don't throw it out.

Cajonpassfan

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #13 on: May 24, 2022, 11:39:56 PM »
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Ooops, sorry Tom, yes I was reading Randgust's post. Thanks for the info on the SP car. Fortunately I have access to a great SP library, I'll check the car out..
Otto

kscessandriver

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Re: Intermountain/CCS Diners
« Reply #14 on: May 25, 2022, 11:50:01 PM »
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Just to follow up on these, has anyone who bought them had issues with coupler boxes not staying together? 3 of the 5 I bought had coupler boxes that were already loose or opened up (coupler having fallen out), straight out of the box. A friend of mine has also reported he's had the same issues. Anyone else seeing this?