Advice about "clock oil" for an engine

[mmagliaro]

I am getting closer to a fully functional "Rocket" model.  I have the valve gear operational.
But since the main rod is propelled around by the driver, and the driver is just a free-rolling wheel,
this whole affair cannot tolerate any friction whatsoever or the wheel can get hung up and will slide along the rail for an instant
before breaking free and continuing to roll.
--
I have honed the mechanism, and it works pretty well back and forth on my test track, but I think it could
work better, without any occasional hang-up, if I could actually lubricate the friction surfaces. 
--
I briefly tried the lightest Labelle oil, but unsurprisingly,
that only made things worse.  Any sort of "oil" is too sticky.  And graphite powder (like the "Grease 'em" stuff
for MT couplers) does not help.
--
I know there is such a thing as "clock oil" used on small clocks and watches, and it supposed to be super clean
and free of any gummy residue.
Does anyone have experience with clock mechanisms and this oil?  I am looking for something that is
super clean with really low viscosity, almost like alcohol.

[Snark45]

Moebius Synt-A-Lube Watch Oil

 I believe this is the lowest-viscosity lubricant available. It's not cheap.   BTW - Meant to thank you for showing us your progress on this very challenging model - it's amazing!  Harry

[peteski]

Moebius Synt-A-Lube Watch Oil

 i believe this is the lowest-viscosity lubricant available. It's not cheap.   Harry

I wonder how it would affect the Amfleet and Comet inside-bearing truck's rolling quality.  As I see it, any lubricant, regardless  of the viscosity, will increase rolling resistance.

I'm also surprised that Daniel, with his affinity for high-end mechanical watches, has not thought of trying watch oil on those trucks.

@daniel_leavitt2000  ?

[MK]

What about dry silicone lube?  Or even Teflon?  Both goes on wet and dries as the carrier evaporates.

[Chris333]

Graphine is what all the kids are talking about. 1000th the width of a human hair. And highly conductive.

[daniel_leavitt2000]

I wonder how it would affect the Amfleet and Comet inside-bearing truck's rolling quality.  As I see it, any lubricant, regardless  of the viscosity, will increase rolling resistance.

I'm also surprised that Daniel, with his affinity for high-end mechanical watches, has not thought of trying watch oil on those trucks.

@daniel_leavitt2000  ?

Easy. It just wouldn't work. It is so light that the weight on the bearing would just ride right through it. There are several dozen styles of watch lube - and you need different types for different sizes of jewel bearings. You're talking about a force change of micro-newtons. It would be like using LeBelle 109 on a real-life fiction bearing truck.

[mmagliaro]

I had already found the Moebius lube.  Can anyone who has actually used this tell me what it's like?  I am expecting
something almost like water with such low viscosity.  As for the graphene - yes... another good though.
I did try some dry teflon, and it had the same behavior as Neolube - basically, while graphite or teflon seem like
good ideas, they do have a certain amount of binder in these products, which ends up causing a little bit of "sticky".
What I might do is see if I can tack a thin strip of Delrin along the valve slider, to let the crosshead ride on that.  I think that
would be ultra slippery without using any lube at all.

[peteski]

Easy. It just wouldn't work. It is so light that the weight on the bearing would just ride right through it. There are several dozen styles of watch lube - and you need different types for different sizes of jewel bearings. You're talking about a force change of micro-newtons. It would be like using LeBelle 109 on a real-life fiction bearing truck.

@daniel_leavitt2000

While I'm not a a fluid dynamics expert, I don't think that is quite what happens. We are talking about smooth surfaces with microscopic voids and pitting, where even low-viscosity lube will still do its job.
The reason I originally suggested to Daniel to maximize the rolling ability of those Kato Amfleet remove all the lubricants and run them dry was because when I was cleaning thickened grease from small ball bearings I noticed that after it was clean and dry, it spun really well.  Daniel confirmed that those Kato trucks roll quite well when unlubricated (better than with the factory-applied lube). But that same dry ball bearing I mentioned earlier spun even better than when dry when I squirted in some Naphtha into it.  Naphtha is a low viscosity liquid.

But Naphtha evaporates fast.  Mineral Spirits (or Paint Thinner) is also a low viscosity petroleum type liquid which evaporates much slower than Naphtha.  Daniel might want to try and see how those Kato trucks roll if he squirts some Paint Thinner (or even Turpentine) into the bearings.  I suspect they will roll even better than when they are dry.

But I'm getting off topic.  I wonder if some WD40 would be a good lubricant for Max?  Have you tried that Max?  WD40 is mostly solvent with a small percentage of lubricant dissolved in it.  The only possible problem I see is that while the WD solvent is still on the moving parts, it will make them run smoother, when it evaporates it leaves a thin lubricant film behind, and that lubricant is rather sticky.  I know because I squirted some WD40 in an open container, and when I looked into it after the solvent evaporated, there was some rather viscous grease left behind.

[peteski]

What I might do is see if I can tack a thin strip of Delrin along the valve slider, to let the crosshead ride on that.  I think that
would be ultra slippery without using any lube at all.

If you could somehow polish all the contact surfaces of the sliding parts, that should also reduce friction.

[NtheBasement]

Another suggestion for silicon spray here...

[Maletrain]

I have been using a spray called Inox MX3 for a lot of things other than model railroad stuff, and wondering how it would work for models.  It is made in Australia https://www.inoxmx.com/products/mx3-lubricant/ but can be bought in the U.S., including through Amazon https://www.amazon.com/INOX-MX3-100g-Inox-Small/dp/B004RZOA0A/ref=sr_1_3 .

It seems to leave a very light, very slippery film that never seems to dry out or gum up.  I have used it on things like door hinge pins that squeak, door rollers that don't want to roll, etc. and am impressed that it does not seem to go away for many years of use, where other lubes have lasted less than a year in the same applications.  I have also used it for more highly machined surfaces (e.g., firearm mechanisms) with similar results.

My only concern with model railroads is whether it might affect some of the plastic gears.  It says it is safe on hard plastics.  But, over the years I have noticed that its manufacturer has added a warning about degrading rubber surfaces with "long-term use".  Since this stuff doesn't seem to ever go away, I don't see how any use would not be "long term" unless the object lubricated is a throw-away.

Has anybody on TRW used this stuff on model railroad items?  With what results, good and bad?

[John]

this seems promising

https://www.amazon.com/Horace-Whitlocks-Clock-Oil-Synthetic/dp/B08294ZBSD/ref=sr_1_4?crid=JUFJ1LC28G01&keywords=Moebius+Synt-A-Lube+Watch+Oil&qid=1640701780&sprefix=moebius+synt-a-lube+watch+oil%2Caps%2C292&sr=8-4#HLCXComparisonWidget_feature_div

[learmoia]

Maybe this?...
[ Guests cannot view attachments ]

(Sorry couldn't resist..)

[randgust]

OK, Max, I have to ask.... other than rolling around, is that single driver functional for electrical pickup purposes?   Because if it isn't, I'd do just the opposite, put a light layer of bullfrog snot on it so that it doesn't slide on the railhead.   Maybe even just on one side.   Have to ask, anyway.

[paultccrn]

   I second the bullfrog snot idea!
Because the wheel only slips some of the time,
maybe just lightly abrading the wheel tread with fine sandpaper, to add a whisker of additional friction, would do the trick.