Sound notching with ESU

[jdcolombo]

I will say that since I switched to all-steam operations this year, the operators are a LITTLE more inclined to at least blow the whistle!

I really think this all boils down to the lack of a consistent and intuitive user interface.  It seems we have gotten to the point with sound decoders that pretty much everyone understands that you press F1 to turn on the bell and F2 for the whistle/horn.  Beyond that, however, the user interfaces for different sound decoders are wildly incompatible, and even with a single decoder brand, different people map function keys differently.  For example, I've now standardized on using F3 to turn on the Mars light on my Berks and PA-1's, and F7 is either Drive Hold (for diesels) or Heavy Load (for steamers, which I've set up only to increase the chuff laboring, and not like Drive Hold for diesels).  But I've noticed that factory setups for diesels often used F5 or F7 for the Mars light, and the default function key for Drive Hold for ESU is F9, with F10 for the Independent Brake (which I don't use at all).  So an operator comes to my layout maybe once every two months for a session.  She doesn't remember what F3 or F7 does.  I can explain, of course, but it isn't familiar enough to be "automatic", like pressing F2 to blow the whistle.  Add in the whole problem of latching vs. non-latching function keys and you've got a user interface nightmare.

Programmable function keys help, but I've found that most everyone (including me) hates touch screens for train operations.  They want hard buttons and a knob or at least hard up/down throttle buttons.  Fortunately, we now have some advanced hard-button throttles that provide programmable buttons - like the TCS UWT-100, which is hands-down the best throttle I've ever used, and I've used practically everything, including ESU, Digitrax, NCE, MRC, etc.  I'm moving to all TCS UWT-100's for my layout.  It's that good.

John C.

[Maletrain]

I think the selective compression of layout places, plus the fast clock compression of time, tends to make the manual uses of sound hard to live with in op sessions that involve multiple people, especially multiple guests that are not familiar with the layout and have not optimized their approaches to its particular switching challenges. 

On the other hand, on a familiar home layout, especially one that does not have so much operating challenge built into a small space, use of sounds in a more realistic manner tends to counter the potential boredom of doing the familiar switching run many times, with just a few variations of cars and industries. 

On the layout I am still planning, I intend to put whistle posts, speed signs, etc. in realistic relationship to layout features.  I am reading up on sound signals to brakemen, flagmen, etc. I am even contemplating working derails for some industrial spurs.  Those things don't interest everybody, but some of us appreciate them.

jdcolombo posted while I was typing, and I agree with what he said, too, about not having standard locations and strategies for producing sounds.  Even if we had a standard for steam and another standard for diesels, it would be confusing for some folks who did not do one or the other very often. 

So, for things that are "automatic" in the real world, such as revving a diesel prime mover before the loco starts to move, would be welcome.  Software that integrates the nature of that with the momentum setting seems like a good feature to have in the decoder.  I think the ESU and Paragon decoders that I am using now are doing a decent job of at least delaying the motion with momentum while automatically stepping up the prime mover as soon as I advance the throttle setting.  It seems to work pretty well at default settings. 

On the other hand, blowing for a crossing seems to work better manually, because a real engineer does it manually, not completing the last blast until the train has blocked the crossing.  If that was somehow automated, then I would need to figure out just where to start the automatic sequence on the track at each train speed to get the end to be when the loco got into the crossing.  That would be more work than just blowing the horn manually.

[jdcolombo]

Agree that the advanced use of sound is more approachable for someone running their own layout.  Before I switched to all-steam, I'd routinely use Drive Hold when running trains myself between op sessions.  And I still use "heavy load" for the steamers now.  But until we get better user interfaces, expecting "outsiders" to use these features isn't terribly realistic.

John C.

[Cajonpassfan]

John makes some very good points, he always does. I've experienced similar challenges with guests (some of whom can't/won't be brought along regardless of the interface ). So I wonder how much of the challenge is the result of our ever-evolving, ever "improving", always changing technology, with multiple products and myriad options always becoming available.
I've pretty much decided that for the years I have left to participate in this hobby, I'm sticking with a bit outdated system that I and most of my train friends know and use (in our case NCE radio, but it could be any other decent system). Perhaps the collective knowledge and the ability to share it, as well as sharing throttles for larger op sessions on several layouts has value beyond the latest technological wonders. And god, how I hate using smartphones as throttles; might as well play video games or watch train porn
Just my two old fashioned cents,
Otto

[Maletrain]

John makes some very good points, he always does. I've experienced similar challenges with guests (some of whom can't/won't be brought along regardless of the interface ). So I wonder how much of the challenge is the result of our ever-evolving, ever "improving", always changing technology, with multiple products and myriad options always becoming available.
I've pretty much decided that for the years I have left to participate in this hobby, I'm sticking with a bit outdated system that I and most of my train friends know and use (in our case NCE radio, but it could be any other decent system). Perhaps the collective knowledge and the ability to share it, as well as sharing throttles for larger op sessions on several layouts has value beyond the latest technological wonders. And god, how I hate using smartphones as throttles; might as well play video games or watch train porn
Just my two old fashioned cents,
Otto

There is a lot of value in maintaining a stable interface.  But, the problem is that that interface eventually becomes obsolete and costly, if not impossible, to maintain. 

So, I think we each are going to have to chose what satisfies us with our own particular priorities, and maybe purchase our own spare hoard, to keep going as long as we can, or want to. 

Sometimes, I see something new that I want, but to get it and use it, I need an upgraded system.  And that opens the door to all of the headaches of upgrading.  DCC and sound are the two major upgrades of my MRR hobby lifetime.  Not sure if there will be any more - now that my medical horizon is much closer.