Author Topic: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?  (Read 1546 times)

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jargonlet

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #15 on: June 05, 2021, 07:08:18 PM »
+2
I have the book C&O Freight Cars 1937-1946. It has pictures and covers all the freight cars they had during that time period. It tells how many they inially had and then how many in each year 1937 and 1946 and what year the last one went out service. Every October, I run on the Hinton Rail Museum's layout during their Railroad Days festival. The festival is both weekends that the New River Train runs from Huntington, WV to Hinton, WV.

I had been picking up C&O hoppers and wanted to have an accurate coal drag to run on their layout. Since I am weird and enjoy these kind of things, I made a spreadsheet to see what an accurate by the numbers C&O coal drag would look like. I did the math to narrow it down to what it would look like with only 50 cars, well by the numbers... I took all of the captive service hoppers out, hoppers like mow and aggregate hoppers. Something else that may look a bit odd when reading the "roster" is what I call "50 ton other". In the 1937 list that consisted of the 50 ton baby triples and the 23 panel side hoppers. I did not take out the 3 bay panel sides though. In the 1946 list the "50 ton other" adds the war relief hoppers. Some may ask when they started rebuilding them, the book said 1953-1954 with the last being finished in 1957.

1937 C&O coal drag
35 50 ton
9   70 ton triple
4   70 ton quad
2   50 ton other

50 ton make up
42% rib side
51% offset
7%  other


1946 C&O coal drag
35 50 ton
7   70 ton triple
3   70 ton quad
5   50 ton other

50 ton make up
25% rib side
63% offset
12% other





simsuper80

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #16 on: June 05, 2021, 07:12:22 PM »
0
Another consideration is how many cars will that loco pull.  Like if you buy 40 hopper cars, but the loco will only pull 25?

If the em-1 is any sign (i hear it is a fantastic puller) hopefully the added weight of brass will make the allegheny a good puller as well

jargonlet

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #17 on: June 05, 2021, 07:13:36 PM »
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What's interesting compared to a lot of other roads is that the C&O didn't show much interest in buying bigger hoppers prior to late 40s. All of the 70 ton triples they had 1937-46 were rebuilt, some from quad hoppers. It also seems that most of the older 50 ton (55 ton, C&O classed them as 50 ton) that they had did not have the peaked ends. The newer hoppers they replaced them with came with several variations on the peaked ends although some of those did not have peaked ends.

spookshow

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #18 on: June 06, 2021, 07:12:35 AM »
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If the em-1 is any sign (i hear it is a fantastic puller) hopefully the added weight of brass will make the allegheny a good puller as well

The Key brass 2-6-6-6's have traction tires and pull very well. I didn't note a maximum number of cars in my review, which probably means I ran out of cars before I ever found the limit. The only real flaw is that they employ the old "single stiff wire on the drawbar" current transfer scheme, but there are ways to improve that.

-Mark

Kentuckian

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #19 on: June 07, 2021, 11:16:54 AM »
+1
I would be remiss not to mention the excellent choices offered by Atlas. IMHO, both of their boxcar and hopper models offered in the last few years are excellent.
Modeling the C&O in Kentucky.

“Nature does not know extinction; all it knows is transformation. ... Everything science has taught me-and continues to teach me-strengthens my belief in the continuity of our spiritual existence after death. Nothing disappears without a trace.” Wernher von Braun

Rasputen

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #20 on: June 07, 2021, 01:17:37 PM »
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I'm also interested to know how many cars these can pull.  I plan on running some tests as soon as I can fit a decoder in one.

simsuper80

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #21 on: June 07, 2021, 03:17:24 PM »
0
Would these trains have cabooses at the end?

jargonlet

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #22 on: June 07, 2021, 03:31:36 PM »
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Would these trains have cabooses at the end?

Always. The atlas c&o type which they call a center cupola. You’ll want the red one as opposed to the yellow one.

thomasjmdavis

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #23 on: June 07, 2021, 05:20:29 PM »
+1
Would these trains have cabooses at the end?

Not only a caboose, but the trains, when loaded, often had another Allegheny (or other articulated) as a helper on the end in addition to the caboose, until they crested the mountains.

For the cost of 4 or 5 new hoppers (ie- buying 95 instead of 100), one could obtain a membership to the C&O historical society and additionally, whatever book or back issues they recommend to give in depth information on the equipment, practices, coal mines, customers, etc.  Also, if one lives in areas once served by the C&O, the local library may have some of these resources.  While I am not a C&O modeler, as it happens, the old C&O line that once served the Lake Michigan ferry docks in Ludington and still serves some of the factories nearby, is 500 feet north of my house.  The local libraries indeed have several books on the C&O- although focused more on local operations than coal hauling in Virginia.
Tom D.

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Allegheny

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #24 on: June 08, 2021, 10:14:47 PM »
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About 10 years ago I purchased Bernie Kempinski's Key Imports Allegheny #1644 when he moved from N-scale to Civil War O-Scale modeling.  He'd had it modified and added a decoder.  It is quite heavy compared to the Bachmann EM-1 and Athearn Big Boy.  I ran it years ago at the Danville, VA train show with the Eastern N-Lines group. 

On level track it managed to pull mix of approximately 104 Athearn, Atlas, Bachmann, Bowser, and Micro-Trains hoppers.  It did slip and need a nudge now and then, but it will pull.

Your milage may vary, depending on your Allegheny's condition, modification and how well it conducts current from track to motor.
“Even if you are on the right track, you’ll get run over if you just sit there.”
― Will Rogers

randgust

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #25 on: June 09, 2021, 01:32:00 PM »
0
Years ago I had a friend that modelled B&O in N scale, and had a pair of Rowa 2-8-8-2's (yes, N&W, but lettered B&O) and a basement sized layout with wide curves and 1% grades.    He wanted the ultimate 100-car coal train behind one.

He contacted Micro-Trains direct and had them do a custom run of 100 cars of the two-bay, 34' 50-ton cars - black - with B&O.    I remember they were a good price, and they were also a unique car number not available retail.   And yes, a Rowa 2-8-8-2 could handle a 100-car train on his layout.   The scary part was watching that thread an 11-inch radius reverse loop at one end, and it still did it.    Yes, those are light cars.

Years later, he took about 10 of the cars and put them up for sale and got absurd prices for them as a limited-edition special run car.   He was a CPA and financial advisor, and I'll never forget him saying that the highest-yield investment in his portfolio turned out to be N scale hoppers.

I'm quite sure MT still does custom runs, as many others do as well, just an aside when you need that many cars. 

On his passing, all those cars were sold, I'm sure they ended up all over, if anybody got one let me know.   Standard MT hopper, but a unique car number.  He wasn't anal enough to insist on individual car numbers - watching that train snake over his layout was spectacular enough.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2021, 01:40:00 PM by randgust »

simsuper80

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #26 on: June 10, 2021, 02:36:08 AM »
0
About 10 years ago I purchased Bernie Kempinski's Key Imports Allegheny #1644 when he moved from N-scale to Civil War O-Scale modeling.  He'd had it modified and added a decoder.  It is quite heavy compared to the Bachmann EM-1 and Athearn Big Boy.  I ran it years ago at the Danville, VA train show with the Eastern N-Lines group. 

On level track it managed to pull mix of approximately 104 Athearn, Atlas, Bachmann, Bowser, and Micro-Trains hoppers.  It did slip and need a nudge now and then, but it will pull.

Your milage may vary, depending on your Allegheny's condition, modification and how well it conducts current from track to motor.

I am thinking about sending it in to all brass pickup for some upgrades, but the price has me a little undecided
« Last Edit: June 10, 2021, 02:37:43 AM by simsuper80 »

Kentuckian

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #27 on: June 10, 2021, 07:53:07 AM »
0
Ah, the new world of N scale brass steam operation. You are in for an education. I think it is worth it. You are starting at a 300 level class in my opinion. Any mallet is going to be kind of complicated. Don’t be discouraged. Work slowly and ask questions and you will be fine.

You can do some mods to the tender to improve pickup. The tender may be the best place to start as it is much simpler than the locomotive. Our own @mmagliaro wrote an excellent how to article in the Ntrak 2016 Steam Annual on how to do this. It is available from Nrail - they recently changed their name from Ntrak. If you want to enter the world on N scale steam it may be worth the $100.00 to buy the whole set of Steam Annuals.
Modeling the C&O in Kentucky.

“Nature does not know extinction; all it knows is transformation. ... Everything science has taught me-and continues to teach me-strengthens my belief in the continuity of our spiritual existence after death. Nothing disappears without a trace.” Wernher von Braun

Ed Kapuscinski

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #28 on: June 10, 2021, 10:45:40 AM »
0
Ah, the new world of N scale brass steam operation. You are in for an education. I think it is worth it. You are starting at a 300 level class in my opinion. Any mallet is going to be kind of complicated. Don’t be discouraged. Work slowly and ask questions and you will be fine.

You can do some mods to the tender to improve pickup. The tender may be the best place to start as it is much simpler than the locomotive. Our own @mmagliaro wrote an excellent how to article in the Ntrak 2016 Steam Annual on how to do this. It is available from Nrail - they recently changed their name from Ntrak. If you want to enter the world on N scale steam it may be worth the $100.00 to buy the whole set of Steam Annuals.

And you will ALSO be pleasantly amused by the number of familiar names that appear in the later ones.

dem34

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Re: N scale brass allegheny: appropriate rolling stock?
« Reply #29 on: June 10, 2021, 05:46:56 PM »
0
It is a known fact that there is only like 30 people attempting fine scale 1/160 modelling at any one time.
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