Author Topic: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!  (Read 13688 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Lemosteam

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4895
  • Gender: Male
  • PRR, The Standard Railroad of my World
  • Respect: +1868
    • Designer at Keystone Details
Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« on: January 21, 2021, 07:12:06 PM »
+25
The Protomate patent and trademark have been graciously bestowed to me by a most kind and incredible gesture from @DKS himself. This announcement comes with sadness in my heart knowing his condition is what precipitated this action. We had been working on the design together until that time came.

Simultaneously, I cannot describe how I feel from this unexpected act of kindness. I am completely, and utterly humbled.

Without adieu, I present the 2021 version of the Protomate in various poses:

“The Handshake”


“The Social Distance”


“The Solidarity”


The “Let’s make a Spring!”


“iExploded”


“Build Me 1”


“Build Me 2”


“Love the Lid”


“And Then There Were Three”


Early spring testing of an earlier design level:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/7wfefeDkWNC59SR9A

More later......

ChristianJDavis1

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 557
  • Gender: Male
  • I almost killed DKS.
  • Respect: +222
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2021, 07:40:21 PM »
0
Glad to see that these are still happening; I remember him telling me that you were the new owner and I was excited at the prospect of them being produced. The original samples you sent him seemed promising and I was hoping I'd get to test one but then with his diagnosis it got put on hold. Let me know if/when you need testers for these; I'd love to be a part of it somehow. Are these shapeways prints?
- Christian J. Davis

draskouasshat

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 847
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +243
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2021, 09:32:32 PM »
0
Id love to see these mounted on a model for comparison!
EFM (Elite Fleet Modeler) member #1
I want a 3800 class santa fe 2-10-2!
I want a 3800 class santa fe 2-10-2!
I want a 3800 class santa fe 2-10-2!
I want a 3800 class santa fe 2-10-2!
I want a 3800 class santa fe 2-10-2!
Modeling Cajon Pass in 1947

jdcolombo

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 2092
  • Respect: +757
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2021, 09:53:42 PM »
0
Yes, a photo of one next to a standard MT would be helpful.  I know these are much closer to scale size.

John C.

GaryHinshaw

  • Global Moderator
  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 5992
  • Respect: +1461
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2021, 09:57:56 PM »
0
Very exciting news!  Can't wait to see more.

narrowminded

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 2165
  • Respect: +673
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2021, 11:04:59 PM »
0
Good deal, John! 8)
Mark G.

peteski

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 26941
  • Gender: Male
  • Honorary Resident Curmudgeon
  • Respect: +2883
    • Coming (not so) soon...
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2021, 11:13:01 PM »
+6
That is an excellent news John!  I'll PM you a bit later.

The coupler looks good.  The spring will likely have to be made from much lighter wire.

I also know that you are in love (for your good reasons) with the Shapeways FUD (or whatever they call that printing process now), but the surface finish is terrible!!!
Couldn't you try rendering these prototypes on one of the SLA printers many members here use and achieve much smoother finish, and probably at higher resolution. Their resin is probably also stronger and more flexible. I realize that you have some reservations about the print dimensional accuracy, but it seems that once the slicer software is properly configured, the printouts are quite accurate.
. . . 42 . . .

Chris333

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 16285
  • Respect: +4070
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2021, 12:05:55 AM »
+2
He is probably using Shapeways for dimensional  accuracy.  ;)

peteski

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 26941
  • Gender: Male
  • Honorary Resident Curmudgeon
  • Respect: +2883
    • Coming (not so) soon...
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2021, 02:52:42 AM »
0
He is probably using Shapeways for dimensional  accuracy.  ;)

That's exactly why, but the recent info posted in the 3D section show that the hobby SLA printers can ale be accurate after the slicer software has been properly set up.
. . . 42 . . .

Lemosteam

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4895
  • Gender: Male
  • PRR, The Standard Railroad of my World
  • Respect: +1868
    • Designer at Keystone Details
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2021, 07:45:07 AM »
+2
That is an excellent news John!  I'll PM you a bit later.

The coupler looks good.  The spring will likely have to be made from much lighter wire.

I also know that you are in love (for your good reasons) with the Shapeways FUD (or whatever they call that printing process now), but the surface finish is terrible!!!
Couldn't you try rendering these prototypes on one of the SLA printers many members here use and achieve much smoother finish, and probably at higher resolution. Their resin is probably also stronger and more flexible. I realize that you have some reservations about the print dimensional accuracy, but it seems that once the slicer software is properly configured, the printouts are quite accurate.

Does this answer your question?



@peteski so, yes, I have tried resin prints. The clearances are very tight inside the box and the shape of the coupler must be accurate.

The first resin set bloomed so much, the un named helper had to manually remove pixels in the slicer for each section just to keep the shape close, but even that did not work. I had to create a special model, just to get it to engage.

The FUD is perfect for dimensional control at this stage. Regardless, there is no printed version that can rival the smoothness and slipperiness of the delrin castings.

That said, and many resin printing lessons learned, later there may be new reasons to try it again.

WRT the spring, I assume you watched the short video link and the spring will be the biggest challenge going forward, but I do not see any insurmountable obstacles.



narrowminded

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 2165
  • Respect: +673
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #10 on: January 22, 2021, 09:14:53 AM »
+1
... and the spring will be the biggest challenge going forward, but I do not see any insurmountable obstacles.

If I had samples of a box and couplers at the final dimensions, everything that makes a complete assembly, I could make some proper springs.  I would fully expect some experimenting with tension, wire gauge, and such, dialing in the final dimensions for best performance. 

Once a spring was finally decided upon I could design and make a tool to repeatedly make the springs accurately but manually, one at a time.  The idea of this tool would be to execute sufficient numbers for field testing.   Once any real volume is involved (hundreds, thousands, tens of thousands  :o) it would be time to get a spring manufacturer to quote producing them for you.  If no satisfactory supplier could be found a more automated tool could be made but that could get a little expensive depending on how fancy you wanted to get.  Using a manual prototyping tool to make those in any volume could drive a person to drink.  If it's really successful it could lead to a complete breakdown, hard drugs, and believing in conspiracy theories,.  :o :facepalm:

If that would be helpful let me know when you're ready.  As far as cost, either a million dollars or nothing, your call. :| ;)
Mark G.

jereising

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 738
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +601
    • The Oakville Sub
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #11 on: January 22, 2021, 10:58:56 AM »
0
Most interesting.  I would replace all my True scale couplers....because why not!
Jim Reising
Visit The Oakville Sub - A Different Tehachapi - at:
http://theoakvillesub.itgo.com/
And on Trainboard:
http://www.trainboard.com/grapevine/showthread.php?t=99466

Lemosteam

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 4895
  • Gender: Male
  • PRR, The Standard Railroad of my World
  • Respect: +1868
    • Designer at Keystone Details
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #12 on: January 22, 2021, 11:12:36 AM »
0
If I had samples of a box and couplers at the final dimensions, everything that makes a complete assembly, I could make some proper springs.  I would fully expect some experimenting with tension, wire gauge, and such, dialing in the final dimensions for best performance. 

Once a spring was finally decided upon I could design and make a tool to repeatedly make the springs accurately but manually, one at a time.  The idea of this tool would be to execute sufficient numbers for field testing.   Once any real volume is involved (hundreds, thousands, tens of thousands  :o) it would be time to get a spring manufacturer to quote producing them for you.  If no satisfactory supplier could be found a more automated tool could be made but that could get a little expensive depending on how fancy you wanted to get.  Using a manual prototyping tool to make those in any volume could drive a person to drink.  If it's really successful it could lead to a complete breakdown, hard drugs, and believing in conspiracy theories,.  :o :facepalm:

If that would be helpful let me know when you're ready.  As far as cost, either a million dollars or nothing, your call. :| ;)

Thanks @narrowminded, but you are behind on the curve. Prototype spring manufacturing already in process, lol. Only a few hundred more to go... :lol: 8)




delamaize

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 2261
  • Gender: Male
  • Prairie Line Native
  • Respect: +330
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #13 on: January 22, 2021, 11:18:33 AM »
+1
This is too Cool! I'm so glad this project is still kicking around! Thanks DKS for keeping it going, and thanks to John for taking the torch and running!!
I'm excited to see these continue to be developed, and I have a feeling that I will have a lot of conversions to do in the future.
Mike

Northern Pacific, Tacoma Division, 4th subdivision "The Prarie Line" (still in planning stages)

amato1969

  • Crew
  • *
  • Posts: 1133
  • Gender: Male
  • Respect: +397
Re: Rumors of Protomate’s demise are greatly exaggerated!
« Reply #14 on: January 22, 2021, 12:07:24 PM »
0
Like @delamaize I too am super-interested, especially for extended draft gear usage.  I need to double-check the vertical dimensions of the ProtoMate...

  Frank