Author Topic: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.  (Read 2348 times)

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Mark5

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #45 on: July 21, 2020, 04:47:38 PM »
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Charlie,

The MTL, Atlas, and LL/Industrial hoppers all based on the N&W H11a,b,c,d,e design.

For the Tangent 4 bay - see the Tangent site. :trollface:

(I actually have samples of all of the cars in your photo, except for the N scale version of the B-Man)

You can see that the end slope sheets are quite different on the Bah-Man model.

The Bachmann model (I assume) will be the same Bethlehem 100 ton that they did in HO scale (I have one for my HO mini-layout).

https://shop.bachmanntrains.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=258_324_325_352&zenid=shnjrj8qrhis6r60kg9mcj6qo7

Mark

basementcalling

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #46 on: July 21, 2020, 10:09:16 PM »
+1
That the Bachmann MSRP is higher than the Tangent Models offering was tells you all you need to know about Botchmann.  It irks me to no end that a company that seems to target beginning modelers with it's sets and offerings (Bachmann is about the only brand you find in big box stores with a selection of trains) probably drives new hobbyists out of the hobby with the quality of their offerings and prices.  $47 for a car is damn hard to justify as a purchase for junior's entry level loop on the floor. 

And don't get me started on the sound premium. $100 for bad quality noise from crappy speakers? Nope.
Peter Pfotenhauer

ncbqguy

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #47 on: July 21, 2020, 11:08:05 PM »
+2
Mark-   
Just thought it would be illustrative to compare cars of a somewhat similar prototype type to the new Bachmann car.
Charlie Vlk

Mark5

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #48 on: July 22, 2020, 07:58:14 AM »
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$47 for a car is damn hard to justify as a purchase for junior's entry level loop on the floor. 

Funny thing is that the N version is $9 more than the HO version!  :trollface:

Mark-   
Just thought it would be illustrative to compare cars of a somewhat similar prototype type to the new Bachmann car.
Charlie Vlk

Ah thanks Charlie - appreciate it. 8)

Mark

Rossford Yard

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #49 on: July 22, 2020, 06:15:46 PM »
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Without going into what prototypes these cars are supposed to replicate, here is a comparison of four existing cars that are/were on the market that are similar to the new Bachmann car.  While there are differences (I do not have cars in hand to analyze in detail) it appears that the Bachmann is closest to the Micro-Trains especially in the slope sheet.
Charlie Vlk

(Attachment Link)

I'm not in the market for that era coal hopper, so I probably shouldn't comment.  Gotta ask if those wheel sets would fit my Atlas Code 55 track?  They look a bit clunky compared to the other low profile wheels.

As to $47, I didn't even like the Auto Racks at $40, but then, I'm an old coot.  Seems like I was when I started in N scale in 1990, I bought MT hoppers for under $10, which would translate to close to the $21 street price now for MT hoppers.  Still, and not one to complain about prices, just trying to understand it.  I do recall thinking $20 was a mental barrier to buying new rolling stock, and I still balk at much over $30 for a 40-70 foot car.  Hey, at least they had the good sense to hold it under my new mental barrier of $50.....

I do recall talking to a Bachmann rep years ago, pretending to be interested in opening an LHS (we all are, just a matter of how seriously we consider it).  I was surprised by the number of discount rates he showed for various volume factors, with indication that a good Italian dinner might get me one level lower than he was authorized to offer officially, LOL.  I had assumed that there was one wholesale price, and perhaps a small discount for bulk purchases and paying on time.  So, I am under the impression that yes, B Mann does set retail prices for the eventual blowout type sale, which seems sort of counter productive, but what do I know?


MetroRedLine

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #50 on: July 22, 2020, 06:30:45 PM »
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That the Bachmann MSRP is higher than the Tangent Models offering was tells you all you need to know about Botchmann.  It irks me to no end that a company that seems to target beginning modelers with it's sets and offerings (Bachmann is about the only brand you find in big box stores with a selection of trains) probably drives new hobbyists out of the hobby with the quality of their offerings and prices.  $47 for a car is damn hard to justify as a purchase for junior's entry level loop on the floor. 

And don't get me started on the sound premium. $100 for bad quality noise from crappy speakers? Nope.

My layout has always been declared a "No Bachmann Zone."

Although, I did own Bachmann Amfleet cars for a time (when they were the only choice), but sold them once I heard Kato ANNOUNCED theirs.
Under the streets of Los Angeles

Ed Kapuscinski

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #51 on: July 23, 2020, 10:10:17 AM »
+3
As to $47, I didn't even like the Auto Racks at $40, but then, I'm an old coot.  Seems like I was when I started in N scale in 1990, I bought MT hoppers for under $10, which would translate to close to the $21 street price now for MT hoppers. 

What's funny about that is that that HAS held true for MTL cars (and many others).
Even the new Tangent gorgeous hoppers are ~$25 street price.
I think the thing worth a raised eyebrow with this Bachmann stuff is that it looks like trainset quality stuff that they're claiming (by price) is better than the best new stuff on the market.

Rossford Yard

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #52 on: July 23, 2020, 10:54:17 AM »
+1
Yeah, the old "locomotives are too expensive now" argument has traditionally broken down by applying the CPI to the prices.  In addition, the newer locos have much more detail and even more features (DCC and DCC and sound).  The latter, I think, it aimed at the long time hobbyist who will spend to upgrade his fleet, just like I sold off many Con Cor Auto racks, happily paying for the higher detail and lower ride of MT, IM/RC etc.  Although, I do think the sound locos really appeal to kids, too.

cjm413

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #53 on: July 23, 2020, 11:12:04 AM »
+1
My layout has always been declared a "No Bachmann Zone."

Although, I did own Bachmann Amfleet cars for a time (when they were the only choice), but sold them once I heard Kato ANNOUNCED theirs.

Bachmann Amfleets can be upgraded from lead sleds, but I'll admit that I took the easy way out with Kato Amfleet I

https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=39504.0

Bachmann NE caboose is the opposite - I sold off my Life-Like ones that hadn't been lowered or repainted yet.   The main issues I found with Bachmann were pretty easy to fix, mainly replacing the 36" wheelsets and boxing glove couplers.

In some ways, Bachmann's early ACF 5250 is a better model than either the Model Power or Atlas/Roco models.   Specifically, it is the only one that has a floor and correct ends, but for some reason,  they did reuse the brake "detail" from the B end on the A end.   It would be nice to have a better model to put all three of them out of their misery...

cjm413

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #54 on: July 23, 2020, 12:07:25 PM »
+1
Yeah, the old "locomotives are too expensive now" argument has traditionally broken down by applying the CPI to the prices.  In addition, the newer locos have much more detail and even more features (DCC and DCC and sound).  The latter, I think, it aimed at the long time hobbyist who will spend to upgrade his fleet, just like I sold off many Con Cor Auto racks, happily paying for the higher detail and lower ride of MT, IM/RC etc.  Although, I do think the sound locos really appeal to kids, too.

I still have one Con-Cor autorack that I upgraded with a Sunrise conversion kit that came with new bolsters to lower the ride height and correct the truck spacing, also new end sills that doubled as additional weight.

The end result is a significant improvement, but it still would need new side panels, etc to bring it up to snuff with the Red Caboose autorack.

johnb

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #55 on: July 23, 2020, 12:13:30 PM »
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$47.00?!?!

“You patented it, and packaged it, and slapped a $47 MSRP on it and now they’re selling it, they’re selling it!

-I don’t think you’re giving us our due credit. Our company is releasing an N Scale hopper that nobody’s ever done before!

Yeah, yeah but your company is so preoccupied with whether or not they could sell a hopper for $47.00, they didn't stop to think if they should!”
in the Facebook feed I stated that the MTL was a better model that was made in America for half the cost.

w neal

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #56 on: July 23, 2020, 07:37:17 PM »
+2
Sorry Mr. Moderator. I can't hold back here.

That Bachmann gondola is virtually the same crappy one I played with as a kid back in the 1970s!! Do they really think they can slap new trucks and couplers on that thing and dare try to get shops to sell it for $29?!? Thats OUTRAGEOUS!! That gon is the same one that will not sell at shows for $3 today on the used tables (back when we had train shows)!!!  What the hell is going on here?
Buffering...

cjm413

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #57 on: July 23, 2020, 10:18:54 PM »
+1
Sorry Mr. Moderator. I can't hold back here.

That Bachmann gondola is virtually the same crappy one I played with as a kid back in the 1970s!! Do they really think they can slap new trucks and couplers on that thing and dare try to get shops to sell it for $29?!? Thats OUTRAGEOUS!! That gon is the same one that will not sell at shows for $3 today on the used tables (back when we had train shows)!!!  What the hell is going on here?

But but but knuckle couplers and metal wheelsets!!

GM50 4164

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #58 on: July 23, 2020, 11:05:58 PM »
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So what did Atlas, intermountain and others introduce? I missed those for some reason.


Benjamin H

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Re: National Virtual Train Show on now at Trainworld Facebook.
« Reply #59 on: July 23, 2020, 11:21:44 PM »
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For anyone who missed the original Facebook Live show, James uploaded the show with time stamps allowing you to skip to manufacturers of interest. He also added missing product photos for those manufactures having technical difficulties.