Conrail SD38 build

[daniel_leavitt2000]

I'm pretty sure that the walkways were blue initially. They used both blue and black anti-slip material and was added during reshopping.

Now I'm wondering if specific shops used black while others used blue? It couldn't be that cut and dry.

The big change came not with the "Quality" scheme, but the intermediate "white frame stripe" that directly preceded it. That was the point that they changed the pilot steps to black, added black anti skid surfaces to the walkways and (usually) the nose. I swear the blue changed to a VERY slightly lighter color around this time. Maybe a change in supplier?

As for the shell, it's pretty much toast. These were fragile as hell and could not be heated or coerced into shape. In fact I had one burst into pieces just drilling the grab holes out. I really wish M4D sold the designs to someone with an Photon. The designs were excellent but the material wasn't.

[u18b]

I'm pretty sure that the walkways were blue initially. They used both blue and black anti-slip material and was added during reshopping.

Now I'm wondering if specific shops used black while others used blue? It couldn't be that cut and dry. 

I can't speak for Conrail.... but it is most true on the CSX side.
Two examples....
On Chessie.... you can tell where a loco was painted by the position of the big blue C on the nose-  is the top edge below the orange strip, even, or above?

The old CSX classic scheme.   Most places painted the stuff below the sill blue.   But Waycross painted it black.

As for the shell, it's pretty much toast. These were fragile as hell and could not be heated or coerced into shape. In fact I had one burst into pieces just drilling the grab holes out. I really wish M4D sold the designs to someone with an Photon. The designs were excellent but the material wasn't.

Ouch.   That's not encouraging.

So it looks like I have a choice.
1.  use a warped shell.  (it looks OK, but it does bow out into the walkway a bit on that side.)
2.  take a chance and see if I can heat it and move it.

If #2 fails, I can look for other alternatives one day.

[JanesCustomTrain]

In an earlier post I said it's painted black, now I say, just paint it the same as the roof   

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1208906

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3369241

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1435269

Jane

[u18b]

I hate having to answer these color questions.
But here is where I came out.....

1.  Studying lots of Conrail photos in general proves beyond doubt that at least some locos had blue walkways.   In particular, I saw an SD40 of the same era as the SD38.  It does not prove anything for the SD38 I've chose, but it opens up a possibility.

2.  when I did an internet search, I found lots of other people had the same exact question- so I'm not alone.

3. Here is Mr. Waller's original photo of an SD38 in Conrail days (I assume the one I chose was not repainted and thus looks the same):  http://crcyc.railfan.net/locos/emd/sd38/cr6937cf.jpg

When I study that photo, I'm looking at the areas on the walkway top surface indicated by the red arrows.  Those lead me to believe that black was not used (on this loco).   I'm posting this photo for educational purposes- with the arrows highlighted.


And lastly, the top surface of the Alco slug behind the SD38 is indeed black-- and it looks a different color than the SD38 walkway not far away.


So this all is what leads me to blue for this loco I'm making.

And while it may be wrong, at least it is not an impossibility (something Conrail never did).

Research like this is always a challenge- and not one I readily enjoy.  But I do it.
(now, Aaron seems to love this kind of challenge.  I'm amazed at the research he does).

[rdg5308]

I agree with @daniel_leavitt2000 in that what I heard many years ago from someone who worked at Juniata in the late 70’s was new power walkways were black and first time repaints were blue.  Of course there were likely exceptions to the rule, and subsequent repaints in the early 80’s may or may not have black walkways. The rules changed again in later 80’s and most did get black.  Photographic proof on the specific loco in clean paint is the only way to know for sure.
The saving grace is that regardless of the walkway color, dirt/grime, rust, oil, and peeling paint very quickly made all of them look the same; a dirty rusty grey.

[u18b]

Yeah...
That would fit the pattern.

These are re-paints.

they were originally Penn Central.
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1680204

So yes, I'm feeling more confident about the blue walkway.

In a way, someone might ask- what difference does it make- they were filthy.
And that's true.

But as the modeler, the end result may be the same.... but how I get there is different.

In this case..... it's all about masking (which I'd rather not have to do if possible).
If black.... then I would have to mask, paint black, and then weather.

But since I'm more confident that the walkways were blue, then I can leave it blue and only worry about weathering.

[daniel_leavitt2000]

Ron, I think you're over thinking the walkway issue. I have anyways just brush painted the walkway area black if needed rather than mask and airbrush. I use Tamiya PC black that's thinned a bit. It doesn't have to be perfect because it will be loaded with weathering anyway.

Now the real fun question is... On that photo you posted with the white frame stripe: is the top of the nose black?

Fortunately for you, I can not recall ever seeing a standard can opener scheme with a black nose. But these transition units drive me nuts.

OK... One more thing. Anyone recall which shop used the mini can opener logo on the sill?

[u18b]

I'm guessing that Conrail practice is the same as CSX when it comes to the nose.
Because people have a need to stand on the nose (eg work on the headlight or number boards), they mix sand with paint on the toip surface of the nose.   This improves traction--- and collects all the crud.

So I actually was not worried about the nose.

And you're right.  Since this loco is so filthy by the time CSX got it, then brush painting the walkway is the way to go- a grayish-railbrown color.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

Undeniably blue (under grime): http://conrailphotos.thecrhs.org/Images/CR-3181-on-the-ground-near-A-St-Lehigh-Ave-in-Philadelphia-PA-1978

Debatably black: http://conrailphotos.thecrhs.org/Images/CR-5606-on-EDPI-5X-at-Philadelphia-PA

Blue (but note the white number boards): http://conrailphotos.thecrhs.org/Images/CR-6509-on-XCX-154-in-Essington-PA

Black (from the factory): http://conrailphotos.thecrhs.org/Images/CR-6090-on-XCG-66W

Blue: http://conrailphotos.thecrhs.org/Images/CR-6510-on-UCG-22E

The answer? Pick the base color that's going to let you capture the color of the grime from the engine you're trying to model.

[Ed Kapuscinski]

OK... One more thing. Anyone recall which shop used the mini can opener logo on the sill?

Is the mini can opener the Juniata decal?
https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-ktdonktq4i/images/stencil/1280x1280/products/228/615/IMG-0460__39452.1545360256.JPG?c=2&imbypass=on

https://conrailshoppe.com/juniata-shop-other-decals/

And by the way... we literally just launched this today.

https://crhscollection.omeka.net/

Everything we've cataloged so far (which is FAR from everything) can be found there. Some even with pictures!

[daniel_leavitt2000]

Is the mini can opener the Juniata decal?
https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-ktdonktq4i/images/stencil/1280x1280/products/228/615/IMG-0460__39452.1545360256.JPG?c=2&imbypass=on

https://conrailshoppe.com/juniata-shop-other-decals/

And by the way... we literally just launched this today.

https://crhscollection.omeka.net/

Everything we've cataloged so far (which is FAR from everything) can be found there. Some even with pictures!

Will the printed material be scanned and available online at some point?

[Ed Kapuscinski]

As time allows. But for now the priority is simply getting a list of everything we have.

[Ike the BN Freak]

I really wish M4D sold the designs to someone with an Photon. The designs were excellent but the material wasn't.

A buddy of mine was talking with Mark to get the designs and was planning on printing them on a Photon, however I think he gave up on the Photon

[u18b]

Here's some news from last night.  Not certain how good it is- I hope it's good.

There was a flat raised "something" inside the shell.  I assumed it was a defect and was integral to the shell.
Turns out it was not.    It was some refuse that sort of got stuck in there and I was able to pull it out.


This is important for 2 reasons.  First, though very thin, it would cause the shell to expand more.  Removing it gives more room.

Second, I discovered it is NOT brittle, but in fact flexible.


So I took a hair dryer to the shell and was able to reshape it, getting most of the bow out of the right wall.
For comparison, here is the before photo with a straight reference line....


And here's the repair (sorry for the different orientation)


Still not perfect, but much better than before.

However, when placed back on the chassis, it still wants to bow out a bit.
So I used files and motor tool to mill the frame a bit more.
At the top on the left side....


And on the right side, both the top and the motor area.


The shell fits better now, and you can hardly see the bow since the shell is more in line with the walkway.


There is still a slight bow in the motor area- so I may use a motor tool and remove just a little bit more.

Now, one more thing.   Chessie System Fan actually gave me two of these M4D shells.  One SD38 and one SD38-2 (in the back).


They do not appear the same.  That is, the SD38-2 is less flexible.  When heated, it will bend, but not easily.  Thus it may be more brittle as described in the warning above.

Which causes me to wonder.... is the SD38 shell not properly cured?

I assume the resin would be cured with UV light- which I don't have.

I may let the shell sit in some bright sunshine for a while (watching it so nothing bad happens!) and see if that firms it up.

[jjb62556]

I wish somebody would make these long shells also. Between DMIR and NAR I could use a few....Jim