Author Topic: BLI - Direction of Travel CV  (Read 548 times)

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joelm

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BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« on: September 02, 2019, 06:42:46 PM »
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Gents: I'm not particularly experienced in programming decoders using individual CV's', since I switched to Decoder pro. But I do know that for most decoders, CV 29 is where you change the normal direction of travel. On my layout the higher loco number of a pair of F-3 A units is the Address for the consist, so I need to change the normal direction of travel for this BLI F-3 to REVERSE. I am programming on the main with my DT 400. (Decoder pro out of action for now - PR-3 issues unresolved at this time.)

In the BLI manual, the CV 29 page talks about a lot of stuff (none of which makes any sense to me),  but no where in that discussion does it mention the words "normal direction of travel". And nowhere else in the manual do I find the term mentioned.

Can someone tell me what CV to use, if it's not 29?  And what the setting should be to have "reverse as the normal direction of travel"?

If it is 29, what do I set CV29 to in order to get reverse as the normal direction of travel?

Thanks, Joel

peteski

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2019, 06:48:56 PM »
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That functionality in CV29 is one of the ones defined in the NMRA DCC standard (so all decoders should have that feature).

Go to Google and search for "CV29 calculator" and you will find more than half a dozen of online calculators which will tell you (in a non-techincal way) what value to set the CV 29 for if you want the model's travel direction reversed)
--- Peteski de Snarkski

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jdcolombo

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #2 on: September 02, 2019, 07:31:35 PM »
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Yes, you need to use CV29, even with a BLI unit.

CV29 does a lot of things, including changing normal direction of travel.  Here are the things it does:

1.  Selects 2-digit or 4-digit addressing
2.  Selects 28/128 speed steps or 14 speed steps
3.  Selects normal direction of travel
4.  Selects whether to use analog conversion mode (allowing decoder to run on analog DC as well as DCC)
5.  Selects whether to use a 28-step speed table (CV's 67-94) vs. using CV's 2, 5 and 6 (if the decoder supports CV6; all of them support CV2 and CV5).

Each of these different choices results in a different value for CV29.  For example, if you want 4-digit addressing, 28/128 speed steps, NO analog conversion mode, REVERSE normal direction of travel, and NO speed table, you need to enter 35 (decimal value) in CV29.  This is probably what you want, but Peteski is correct: use an on-line calculator to give you the correct value for the choices you want.  The Digitrax Calculator is pretty good:

http://www.digitrax.com/support/cv/calculators/

John C.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2019, 07:34:07 PM by jdcolombo »

Cajonpassfan

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #3 on: September 02, 2019, 08:15:47 PM »
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[ Guests cannot view attachments ] Or, Joel, for your situation with just two A’s back to back I assume, you might use the Easy Consist method described in the Paragon 3 manual, p.20, highlights above. It has the advantage of quick deconsisting by CV 19=0 if you want the engine to behave normally for other assignments. Unfortunately, you’re limited to 127 consists, so that may or may not work for you.
Or, bring it over and we’ll put it on the BLI “Address Changer”; it programs address and direction nearly instantaneously.
Otto
« Last Edit: September 02, 2019, 08:21:52 PM by Cajonpassfan »

jdcolombo

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2019, 01:52:53 PM »
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Just to follow up with Otto:

In order to use the BLI quick consist CV's, you have to use Advanced Consisting - that is, you have to select a consist number between 1-127 and use that consist number as the locomotive address when running the consist.

For most people, this is a non-starter, because they want to use the engine number as the DCC address - e.g., you dial up the engine number, and off you go.  The exception is if you use an NCE system, which aliases the unique consist address to the engine number - that is, with an NCE system, it sets up an Advanced Consist with a unique consist address between 1-127, but then allows you to control this consist by selecting the lead engine number, rather than using the unique consist number.  AFAIK, NCE is the only system that does this.

If you are NOT using an NCE system, and if you want to use the engine number as the DCC address, best to stay away from Advanced Consisting.  Why the NMRA chose to hobble advanced consisting with a limited number of addresses is a mystery to me. 

John C.

joelm

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2019, 02:56:37 PM »
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Thanks, Gents! Never occurred to me that there would be such a thing as a CV29 calculator. Thanks for teaching me how to fish! Joel (CV29=35)

peteski

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2019, 06:44:26 PM »
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Thanks, Gents! Never occurred to me that there would be such a thing as a CV29 calculator. Thanks for teaching me how to fish! Joel (CV29=35)

That was exactly why I mentioned a calculator instead of just giving you some arbitrary value to program into CV29.  Knowing how to fish is better than just  having one fish to eat.  :D

But in your case (which I missed in your original post) is that you are consisting multiple locos (using advanced consisting). In that scenario, CV29 does not need to get changed.
--- Peteski de Snarkski

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Albersala

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2019, 07:45:40 PM »
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I want to make a 2-loco consist using the easy consist way of Paragon 3 decoders. It will be a couple of locos: one front engine and one rear engine running backwards. Since it´s the first time I try to do something like this, I have a couple of questions and any help from you, guys will be appreciated.
- Before starting to do anything, do the locos need to have the same address or can they be different?
- Once they are running as a consist do the sounds of one of the locos (bell, horn, etc) turn off automatically or should I turn
  them off manually setting CV´s 135-156 to 0?   
Thanks.                   
« Last Edit: September 09, 2019, 07:47:13 PM by Albersala »

peteski

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2019, 09:54:14 PM »
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I want to make a 2-loco consist using the easy consist way of Paragon 3 decoders. It will be a couple of locos: one front engine and one rear engine running backwards. Since it´s the first time I try to do something like this, I have a couple of questions and any help from you, guys will be appreciated.
- Before starting to do anything, do the locos need to have the same address or can they be different?
- Once they are running as a consist do the sounds of one of the locos (bell, horn, etc) turn off automatically or should I turn
  them off manually setting CV´s 135-156 to 0?   
Thanks.                   

There are 3 types of DCC consisting.  The details of how you will do this, and which of the 3 types you will use depends on you and on what brand of DCC system you use.  You might want to consider reading more about this process:

https://dccwiki.com/MU_consisting
http://www.digitrax.com/tsd/KB575/multiple-unit-or-consist-operations-overview/
http://www.digitrax.com/tsd/KB923/cv19-cv21-cv22-advanced-consist-addressfunction-co/
https://ncedcc.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/205600715-Consisting-Primer-read-first
--- Peteski de Snarkski

-"Look at me, I'm satirical!!!"
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-"Look at me, I'm a curmudgeon!!!!"
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Albersala

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2019, 04:01:07 AM »
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Thanks for the information, Peteski. But I was referring to the Broadway Límited Paragon 3 easy consist instructions.

For example, Paragon 3 manual says: "start with each engine having a unique address". Does it mean both locos must have the same address or different ones?


peteski

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2019, 04:20:59 AM »
+1
Thanks for the information, Peteski. But I was referring to the Broadway Límited Paragon 3 easy consist instructions.

For example, Paragon 3 manual says: "start with each engine having a unique address". Does it mean both locos must have the same address or different ones?


"Each" and "unique" implies different address for each engine.

To me "easy" consisting is the consisting using the generally followed DCC standard.  Other, decoder-brand-specific, consisting seems like an unnecessary complication.  Not sure why BLI does this, especially since it is only designed to work with their brand of decoder.  But of course there is nothing wrong with trying and using their method. I revisited the decoder manual and CV230 is simply used to designate the position of the loco in the consist.  Then they use CV19 (which is a standard CV register, defined by NMRA for advanced consisting).  So you are simply manually creating an advanced consist.

As for the sounds, the manual is not helpful.  I would assume that the sounds like the engine sound will play on all the locos in the consist.  Not sure about the other sounds (horn, bell, etc).
« Last Edit: September 10, 2019, 04:38:29 AM by peteski »
--- Peteski de Snarkski

-"Look at me, I'm satirical!!!"
-"Look at me, I'm anal retentive!!!"
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-"Look at me, I'm snarky!!!!"
-"Look at me, I have OCD!!!"
-"Look at me, I'm a curmudgeon!!!!"
-"Look at me, I'm not negative, just blunt and honest!!!"

Albersala

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2019, 05:52:44 AM »
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"Each" and "unique" implies different address for each engine.

To me "easy" consisting is the consisting using the generally followed DCC standard.  Other, decoder-brand-specific, consisting seems like an unnecessary complication.  Not sure why BLI does this, especially since it is only designed to work with their brand of decoder.  But of course there is nothing wrong with trying and using their method. I revisited the decoder manual and CV230 is simply used to designate the position of the loco in the consist.  Then they use CV19 (which is a standard CV register, defined by NMRA for advanced consisting).  So you are simply manually creating an advanced consist.

As for the sounds, the manual is not helpful.  I would assume that the sounds like the engine sound will play on all the locos in the consist.  Not sure about the other sounds (horn, bell, etc).


[/quote]


That was what I understood in a first reading but then I had doubts about "unique" possibly meaning "common". That´s what happens for not being a native English speaker :(

I wanted to use Paragon 3 easy consist method because both locos I have use that decoder and since it´s going to be my first consist it seems really simple.

As for the sounds, I ´ll have to discover it by myself. In the worst case I´ll have to turn all the sounds manually and that will be all. Not a big issue anyway.

Thanks for your help, Peteski.
 


« Last Edit: September 10, 2019, 05:54:55 AM by Albersala »

Cajonpassfan

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2019, 11:29:28 AM »
+1
I find BLI Easy Consist very easy and functional, but agree that limiting consist numbers to 1-127 may seem like a fatal flaw to many. As to the question about sound in BLI Easy Consist, the bell, whistle/horn, and headlight are all turned off on all but the lead engine, with all other sounds active.
Otto K.

Albersala

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2019, 12:14:11 PM »
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I find BLI Easy Consist very easy and functional, but agree that limiting consist numbers to 1-127 may seem like a fatal flaw to many. As to the question about sound in BLI Easy Consist, the bell, whistle/horn, and headlight are all turned off on all but the lead engine, with all other sounds active.
Otto K.

127 consist addresses are more than enough for me. And I'm glad to hear that the horn, bell and headlights are all turned off on the non-leading engines. That saves a lot of time and effort.
Thanks, Otto K.

joelm

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Re: BLI - Direction of Travel CV
« Reply #14 on: September 10, 2019, 03:44:47 PM »
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Just to close the loop -in my case I only have one BLI F-3 (NYOW #822), which is "permanently" assigned to an Intermountain F-3 (NYOW #825) without sound.  For programming I use it's unique ID (822), but it's Address is 825, and the set runs as 825.  These were speed matched and when I press the horn button, regardless of direction,  of course only the BLI responds. I have to take a look at how to handle the light (on only forward).  Joel