Author Topic: Potential future ESM MIA kit??  (Read 3533 times)

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Ike the BN Freak

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #45 on: August 04, 2018, 12:20:04 PM »
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Peter showed me the frame for the autorack, and its looking nice. I'm looking forward to it

nkalanaga

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #46 on: August 05, 2018, 12:58:07 AM »
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Thank you!  No real hurry at my end, either, but it's good to know it hasn't been cancelled.
N Kalanaga
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Spades

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #47 on: August 05, 2018, 02:22:41 AM »
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Still a work in progress. I got samples of the latest revised pewter flatcars from Peter a month ago and need to see if one model can be assembled from one of the sample printed nickel wrappers, which I had planned on doing this month after procuring/providing all materials needed for the x72 to the contractor. When we know for sure that the kit is viable, there will be a joint ESM/NSK announcement. Currently, the folding fixture for the wrapper is a stumbling block in terms of cost.

Is the stumbling block the roof?  There is probably no pre-existing roof you could use for a form block.  Is the thin nickel that hard to bend?

bbussey

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #48 on: August 05, 2018, 10:42:07 AM »
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The stumbling block is including a jig with the kit that perfectly forms the body wrapper and doesn’t add an exhorbitant amount to the cost or mar the pre-decorated wrapper. The wrapper forms around the entire frame and includes the flatcar detail, wrapping from the bottom of one flatcar side up and over the roof and down to the bottom of the other flatcar side. It contains 12 bend lines, including close opposing 45-degree bends between the top of the flatcar sides and the bottom of the rack sides, because the flatcar is narrower than the rack. Nickel is no more difficult to bend than soft brass, but to expect modelers to perfectly form a 6”x4” decorated wrapper by hand in one shot is not realistic. 
Bryan Busséy
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peteski

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #49 on: August 05, 2018, 12:34:27 PM »
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Nickel is no more difficult to bend than soft brass, but to expect modelers to perfectly form a 6”x4” decorated wrapper by hand in one shot is not realistic.

Nickel? Do you mean nickel-silver?  I have never seen anytime etched from nickel, while  nickel silver is just a type of brass (which can be readily etched).

Can the photoetched fret be annealed before decorating (to make forming even easier)?  For example. I have the standard K&S brass tubing which is not very easily bent and somehow in the batch I b ought there was a piece which must be annealed (or soft?) brass tube.  That one can easily be bent by hand and it retains the bent shape.  If the metal wrapper was made form such soft material, it could be bent easily and retain shape without trying to spring back.  Like we discussed it at the Springfield show I don't like  the idea of the curved bent wrapper needing to be constant tension installed on the model, wanting to partially spring back to straighten out.  If it  was annealed, that problem wild be eliminated or greatly reduced.

Also, how does the decoration (paint) adhere after the bending process?  It will not flake off or crack in time?
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bbussey

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #50 on: August 05, 2018, 01:50:15 PM »
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Nickel-silver.

In regard to the tankcar wrapper, it is preformed before application so there is no tension.

Deco is same process MTL has been using for its recent complex schemes. So far, it appears to be resilient.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2018, 01:53:22 PM by bbussey »
Bryan Busséy
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Spades

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #51 on: August 05, 2018, 02:34:44 PM »
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Bryan

I promise the last question. For the form could you supply 3 to 4 bulkheads with cut out for stringers to form a frame?  Or make the sides separate from the roof. Only 3 folds per side, 4 for the roof. but it would require some internal bracing.

P.S. Sorry about the name miss spelling.

G

bbussey

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #52 on: August 05, 2018, 04:13:18 PM »
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No worries.

It would be difficult to have the sides and roof as separate etchings as far as assembling the model , having the roof be seamless to the sides, and having the model be structurally sound.  The only framework in the model is delicate and similar to the prototype.  The entire model is super-sturdy once assembled, but not as individual parts.  The wrapper aspect allows for a strong structure after being formed and assembled to the flatcar, with the see-though panel design emulating the prototype.  The center of gravity also is very low, which means excellent tracking ability.

What we are looking at now is supplying a resin fixture that allows you to bend ¼ of the wrapper at one time (left half side 1, right half side 1, left half side 2, right half side 2).  The master would me 3D-printed and we would create castings from that.  There are fold lines in the etchings.  We just want to insure that they can be folded easily and perfectly in one attempt, because it's not as if there will be spare decorated wrappers available.

The goal is to have multiple limited releases of this kit, which each release consisting of one road/scheme with three or four car numbers available.  We already have wrapper artwork complete for five releases.  So we have to make the folding process as easy as possible.
Bryan Busséy
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bbussey

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #53 on: August 05, 2018, 04:23:18 PM »
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I was looking through my CB&Q files, and was reminded of this topic.  With the recent import issues, and this car being made in the USA, is there anything new to report?

We proved the sides can be rendered. It’s on the list of items to push forward but no tentative release date as of yet.

A note regarding an eventual BN kit: it will utilize the X58 underbody and all its affiliated parts, including ASF trucks, so it would have to wait until the contractor situation settles out.
Bryan Busséy
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peteski

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #54 on: August 05, 2018, 04:44:42 PM »
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Nickel-silver.

In regard to the tankcar wrapper, it is preformed before application so there is no tension.

Deco is same process MTL has been using for its recent complex schemes. So far, it appears to be resilient.

Sorry - had a brain-fart!  :facepalm:
For some reason I thought this was about your possible future tank car kit. I'll go now and hide in my basement (workshop).  :)
--- Peteski de Snarkski

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nkalanaga

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #55 on: August 06, 2018, 12:58:04 AM »
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"BN kit: it will utilize the X58"

Well, that answers my next question!  If it was entirely American made, except for trucks and couplers, I'd say sell it without the trucks and couplers.  Most HO was sold that way for decades.  But if it also needs the underframe, and I agree that is probably the best way to build it, you're right, it will have to wait.
N Kalanaga
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Ike the BN Freak

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #56 on: August 06, 2018, 02:18:13 AM »
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The issue I see with Bryan selling the car without trucks is that there is a shortage of the trucks. Pretty sure they use the BLMA trucks, so if that is the case, with the lower bolster, won't be an easy swap out with a different brand of trucks

nkalanaga

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Re: Potential future ESM MIA kit??
« Reply #57 on: August 07, 2018, 01:50:53 AM »
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True, but some people don't mind the ride height, and for those of us who do, we could buy and build the car now, then add the trucks later.  We'd have the car, whenever trucks are again available, and it would spread the cost, as well as providing revenue for ESM.  Sooner or later other companies will start making low-bolster trucks, now that there are cars to use them on, and a market for them.

But the X58 underframe is a very nice part, and it wouldn't be worth expense and effort to make a new floor for one car.
N Kalanaga
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