Author Topic: Digitrax DCS - All Locos on Layout Address Changed by Accident  (Read 2240 times)

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peteski

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Re: Digitrax DCS - All Locos on Layout Address Changed by Accident
« Reply #15 on: July 30, 2018, 10:26:14 PM »
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I wish Digitrax would come out with a new version of their DT100s. Or maybe a DT400L (for "light") that doesn't enable all of the dangerous stuff. Just throttle and switches.

I mean, you could always take the DT400s and do the "parents remote trick" of cutting all of the buttons they should never touch off flush.

Funny thing is that trick should be easily implemented in the throttle's firmware by adding this feature to the throttle's setup (without a need to make any physical changes to the buttons themselves.  All it needs is few lines of code.
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superchief

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Re: Digitrax DCS - All Locos on Layout Address Changed by Accident
« Reply #16 on: July 30, 2018, 10:38:53 PM »
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it was operator error, you can program in four different modes in Digitrax, one is PO or ops mode, this is sometime helpful if you want to program a sound loco that requires more power to program on the main. basic programming should only be done only in PG or page mode(the PO or PG is in the center lower part of the screen on a DT400) on the programming track. Yes some owners only give guest operators a UT4 throttle and I am one of them. I had a bid time with a DT400 switching a yard during an op session before I converted to DCC, for a yard operator I only need to control speed and direction to get the job done, at that point all the other buttons were a waste. you can be dangerous too in a car if you do not know how to operate it!!!!! Gordon

C855B

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Re: Digitrax DCS - All Locos on Layout Address Changed by Accident
« Reply #17 on: July 30, 2018, 10:44:40 PM »
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Funny thing is that trick should be easily implemented in the throttle's firmware by adding this feature to the throttle's setup (without a need to make any physical changes to the buttons themselves.  All it needs is few lines of code.

I'd rather see a firmware change to the control station to prevent broadcast ("00") addressing in Ops Mode, or any other mode for that matter. Just adding an OpSw setting for it would also take just a few lines of code, with many fewer devices to update, particularly a control device that is a more logical candidate for occasional firmware revisions. This is especially the case for the DCS240 and recent designs, where there is already a user procedure in place to re-flash firmware from a host PC. Can't say the same for throttles.

Anyway, there may have been a reason for the broadcast programming functionality back in the Dark Ages of DCC, but I fail to see where it is nothing other than a headache-in-waiting nowadays given the plethora of different decoders with CVs doing different stuff all over the place. It needs to be highly restricted by default.

peteski

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Re: Digitrax DCS - All Locos on Layout Address Changed by Accident
« Reply #18 on: July 31, 2018, 05:20:21 AM »
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I'd rather see a firmware change to the control station to prevent broadcast ("00") addressing in Ops Mode, or any other mode for that matter. Just adding an OpSw setting for it would also take just a few lines of code, with many fewer devices to update, particularly a control device that is a more logical candidate for occasional firmware revisions. This is especially the case for the DCS240 and recent designs, where there is already a user procedure in place to re-flash firmware from a host PC. Can't say the same for throttles.

Anyway, there may have been a reason for the broadcast programming functionality back in the Dark Ages of DCC, but I fail to see where it is nothing other than a headache-in-waiting nowadays given the plethora of different decoders with CVs doing different stuff all over the place. It needs to be highly restricted by default.

One use I see for the broadcast packets would be for "emergency stop" speed-step-zero packet to be sent to all locos on the layout.
But if in fact there isn't a good need for the broadcast packets to be utilized in today's DCC then I agree that an OpSw could easily be added so the functionality can be disabled or enabled.  But I still think that a throttle "dumb down" should also be a setting that could be controlled by the user.  And not just in the Digitrax system, but in all systems where a handheld throttle can be used for programming.
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Point353

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Re: Digitrax DCS - All Locos on Layout Address Changed by Accident
« Reply #19 on: July 31, 2018, 06:09:31 AM »
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I wish Digitrax would come out with a new version of their DT100s. Or maybe a DT400L (for "light") that doesn't enable all of the dangerous stuff. Just throttle and switches.
Sort of like the "valet" key that comes with some vehicles.

lyled1117

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Re: Digitrax DCS - All Locos on Layout Address Changed by Accident
« Reply #20 on: July 31, 2018, 09:23:54 AM »
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One use I see for the broadcast packets would be for "emergency stop" speed-step-zero packet to be sent to all locos on the layout.

This is one use of the feature that is important, but most throttles don't have a method to send. It's a speed command as you point out, not a function command.  NCE's (and SYS-ONE originally) big throttle has a button where a single press sends the command and stops the addressed locomotive. Three presses stop all locomotives. The feature can be useful where users put a lot of momentum in a locomotive. An emergency stop commands a locomotive to override any momentum settings and stop NOW. Kind of like removing track power, but not actually doing so.

Lyle D
« Last Edit: August 01, 2018, 09:56:59 AM by lyled1117 »

C855B

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Re: Digitrax DCS - All Locos on Layout Address Changed by Accident
« Reply #21 on: July 31, 2018, 11:02:34 AM »
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Different situation entirely. Broadcasts for running functions is one thing, broadcasts to set parameters like addresses is something else completely. If they're both parsed by the same routines - a parameter is a parameter sort of thing - then this is a huge flaw in the spec and how did we make it this far without getting sucked into the black hole?

Like I said before, my own solution is no provision for Digitrax throttles on my layout. YMMV.

peteski

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Re: Digitrax DCS - All Locos on Layout Address Changed by Accident
« Reply #22 on: July 31, 2018, 11:43:58 AM »
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This one use of the feature that is important, but most throttles don't have a method to send. It's a speed command as you point out, not a function command.  NCE's (and SYS-ONE originally) big throttle has a button where a single press sends the command and stops the addressed locomotive. Three presses stop all locomotives. The feature can be useful where users put a lot of momentum in a locomotive. An emergency stop commands a locomotive to override any momentum settings and stop NOW. Kind of like removing track power, but not actually doing so.

Lyle D

Thanks for that Explanation Lyle.  I have the NCE Power Cab which I only use, on a short piece of track, for testing and programming locos.  I noticed the emergency stop button and have tested that it in fact worked.  However its functionality is not explained in the Power Cab manual, and I did not seek out any additional info on that button (maybe in online documentation or Google searches). I did not know about the 3-presses feature to stop all the locos. Not that I will need to use that anytime soon, since I pretty much use it with a single loco at a time.  But it is good to know how that button works.
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peteski

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Re: Digitrax DCS - All Locos on Layout Address Changed by Accident
« Reply #23 on: July 31, 2018, 11:46:00 AM »
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Different situation entirely. Broadcasts for running functions is one thing, broadcasts to set parameters like addresses is something else completely. If they're both parsed by the same routines - a parameter is a parameter sort of thing - then this is a huge flaw in the spec and how did we make it this far without getting sucked into the black hole?


I have not looked into the DCC specs but I suspect that the same type of packet is used for operational and programming packets.  So addressing scheme would be the same for both.  Just my speculation.
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