Why I don't care for separate factory-applied grabs

[Point353]

So has anyone actually taken a tape measure to a 1:1 grab iron..
~Ian

Literature from current manufacturers of grab irons shows a choice of either 0.75" or 1" for diameter.
Master car builder's standards indicate a minimum clearance of 2.5" between the grab iron and the surface to which it is mounted.

[garethashenden]

And since the model grabs are much thicker than real ones they should sit inward a hair more to make up for the thickness.

Again if they can install those at the factory surely they can install them correctly.

I think that, since the model grabs are too thick, the critical dimension should be body to outside of grab. As opposed to body to center of grab. This way the grabs would be closer to the body and less obtrusive.

[jpwisc]

Don't think so, one of the antennas is the wrong way around.

Jane

For the record, the orientation of the PTC pods on that model are correct.

[mcjaco]

Sorry about the noise (at least in your opinion). Maybe I should have started this thread in the Lounge section where noise is tolerated and even welcome. 

However, to continue the noise, here is the info I promised earlier.  I don't have the exact loco I started this thread on (I only used it as an example). Instead, I measured my Big Blow Turbine model.

There's been soooo many discussions on installed, or not installed, grab irons, either buy the owner or the factory.  Grabs are already oversized, and I'd argue you have to (I know I do), install them too far our scale wise, to make them visable.  Otherwise, what's kind of the point? 

And are we looking at a pre-production photo, or what's hitting the shelves (this is not in reference to the original photo posted, but in general).  We tend to take a overly critical eye to photos which capture every small nuance that we tend to not see in person.  It's like judging color matching via a computer screen, where everyone's monitor settings and color acuteness is different.  There will never be a right answer. 

[nuno81291]

Why do they have to protrude so much to be visible? If anything going from the previous “standard” of a molded on grab that sits close to the body versus these free standing oversized grabs draws too much attention to them. Look at the HO model I posted, I think grabs should not dominate the surface area or they become a detractor. Oversized details for the sake of details isn’t everyone’s cup of tea. I personally prefer the effect on this old atlas GP to what I feel amounts to an out of scale detail. [ Guests cannot view attachments ] but maybe I am too used to looking at proto photos where grabs seem to blend in versus stand out.

[jpwisc]

I like my grab irons to be .020" off the shell. That looks right to my eye. If the Scale Trains ones are further out than that, i may try to fix them. I'll see when my engines show up.

[tehachapifan]

I find it hard to beat the look of BLMA/Atlas grab irons made from .007" wire, IF they're mounted straight and at a proper distance from the mounting surface, as seen on this GP60...



BLMA 18" drop grabs on end of short hood. Roof-mounted grab was from a different mfr....



3 BLMA 18" drop grabs from .007" wire under custom grabs also bent from .007" wire...



I  find that the difference between grab irons made from .007" wire vs. .009" wire is actually quite noticeable. The .007" wire thickness appears just right to my eye and the grabs, to me, are not distracting at all.

When mounting grabs, I do use a spacer jig made from styrene (can't recall thickness right now) that I slide under the grab irons prior to applying ACC to the inside of the shell, using droplets of ACC on the end of a wire. I'll also typically use another piece of styrene over the grab irons to press against while I'm gluing for even pressure. You do need to be careful that glue does not migrate thru the mounting holes and affix the spacer jig using this method (ask me how I know ). I do make sure the width of the spacer jig does not reach close to the mounting holes on either side where glue may migrate thru.

[jpwisc]

The BLMA grabs are nice, but the TrainWorx ones are the next level up.

[tehachapifan]

Yeah, those TWX grabs do look nice! Have to try some of those out.

[JanesCustomTrain]

For the record, the orientation of the PTC pods on that model are correct.

I stand corrected. Thanks. 

Jane

[peteski]

There's been soooo many discussions on installed, or not installed, grab irons, either buy the owner or the factory.  Grabs are already oversized, and I'd argue you have to (I know I do), install them too far our scale wise, to make them visable.  Otherwise, what's kind of the point? 

And are we looking at a pre-production photo, or what's hitting the shelves (this is not in reference to the original photo posted, but in general).  We tend to take a overly critical eye to photos which capture every small nuance that we tend to not see in person.  It's like judging color matching via a computer screen, where everyone's monitor settings and color acuteness is different.  There will never be a right answer.

Yes, that was a pre-production photo, but as I see it, most separate factory-applied grabs exhibit the same problem (in case you missed it, I took photos of a standard production model proving the point).    Your posts griping about this type of discussion are getting pointless. Now I could use a  down-vote button.  While I don't like to say this, I will now: if you don't care for this discussion, don't read this thread. You keep complaining about it which means that you keep on reading it. Well, if it annoys you, skip it.

[wcfn100]

Are the factory grabs painted with the shell or prior to installation?


Jason

[peteski]

Are the factory grabs painted with the shell or prior to installation?

Jason

Yes, it appears that this is the case. Some are applied over Tampo-printed decorations, and many have CA glue stains around them (indicating that thy were applied after the model was painted).  You can see that in the photos I posted earlier.  The red grab/step is applied over Tampo-printed stripe and there is some CA glue visible on it.

[peteski]

I find it hard to beat the look of BLMA/Atlas grab irons made from .007" wire, IF they're mounted straight and at a proper distance from the mounting surface, as seen on this GP60...

I  find that the difference between grab irons made from .007" wire vs. .009" wire is actually quite noticeable. The .007" wire thickness appears just right to my eye and the grabs, to me, are not distracting at all.

When mounting grabs, I do use a spacer jig made from styrene (can't recall thickness right now) that I slide under the grab irons prior to applying ACC to the inside of the shell, using droplets of ACC on the end of a wire. I'll also typically use another piece of styrene over the grab irons to press against while I'm gluing for even pressure. You do need to be careful that glue does not migrate thru the mounting holes and affix the spacer jig using this method (ask me how I know ). I do make sure the width of the spacer jig does not reach close to the mounting holes on either side where glue may migrate thru.

Russ, your grabs look ok to me. That was the whole point of this thread: manufacturers that install free-standing grabs on their RTR models seem to install them sticking out too far, make them too thick, or both.

[tom mann]

Some guy in the RW art dept was working on this today:

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