Not the Seaboard 2.0

[narrowminded]

Thanks Otto.  It's truly appreciated and just the kind of feedback I want.

I tend to agree with everything you have said, cut the side and all.  But, cutting the side isn't an option for the time and effort it would take in all regards and it still would be pretty tight and full of compromises.  That strikes me as something I would definitely consider if I were starting from scratch but not on this board.  I may start another whole layout another day as this is accomplishing my original plan to have something at least decent to run trains and to gain modelling experience.  This is doing that for me.

What I really DID want to do and will still be scrutinizing is the suggestion about the outer track.  The problem with setting the building on the inner two tracks is the clearance to the mainline and the length of this house.  The house length is to accommodate the EM-1 (or a Big Boy someday)  and it takes that length to put it totally under roof.  As the track exists in that area it sets the engine house too close to the mainline coming through and I'm not sure that in that place there is much option.  I haven't fully investigated that yet but first looks say no.  If that is an option that would be my preferred way, too.  No matter which way I go all of that track and surface in that corner is going to need to be redone so another thing that I considered, at a glance doesn't look too promising but... is to put a slight turn to all of the rails to at least set everything at a little bit of an angle.  That's the only issue right now that's really bugging me with the rest being desired but not make or break.

What I may be confronted with is the option as shown that readily handles all of those issues.  OR possibly step the mainline side bay back maybe a quarter length or so which might let me have the one full length bay and one decent length, yet to be determined.  The track clears as shown but when you put a building corner with doors on it right at the tightest point, no good.  Another option is just shorten the building entirely and forego the big steam fitting entirely under roof.  That would open up the possibility that you described, is not terribly different than how the original house was positioned, and would handle yours and my issue of the square to the edge business.  I'm still making up some "additions" that may look good and add enough interesting detail to overcome the downside identified.  And this is an example of my artistic sense being challenged but the mockups will help with that.

And finally, one reason I hate to shorten the building is the possibility of reusing it someday and to a plan that accommodates all of these things.  Or maybe I shouldn't put too much work into detailing the interior so much and just build a nice, basic shell pretty much as the mockup shows.

BTW, the whole protoype Thurmond scene would be something to model.  It is actually very small, not much more than a city block in any direction but chock full of all sorts of interesting and unique details.  I think it's a modeller's dream.

[narrowminded]

That would be Mr. Paul Fulks of Cantington N-Trak.

We were nosing around Thurmond  a  few years back and  a ranger from NPS happened to be there doing some maintenance. He let us in the station and said we could go upstairs but cautioned us there might be a few dead things up there since no one was there much in the winter. There was a layer of dead beetles on the entire floor about 3/4" thick.

Tell Mr. Fulks somebody out there admires his work.  The scene was done such that before I saw the sign that was above it and at first glance I remarked to my friend, "That's Thurmond".    Very well done.

And your advice if visiting in the winter is bring ketchup?!

[Lemosteam]

Why not take the "mock-up" and simply layer materials over it now to finish it off? Add a fascia and rake boards to the end of that nice roof.

Or go down to FEDEX store and have the image printed on their thickest cardstock, cut out the windows, assemble and layer that with the materials of your choice.  Just like some old fashioned architectural models are made.

Or Gallitzin Station, right @chicken45 ?

[narrowminded]

I played with the placement some and at least for me, setting the building at an angle while still using the far right track for a house entrance makes a HUGE difference in the look.   This approximate position would be totally doable and even improves on the old look, making everything appear more open, at least to me.   

The third track would run down the left side instead of the right and could be angled away from the building, run parallel, possibly spaced out with a loading platform against the building, or... 

There may be room to add a shop extension (I think), and/ or possibly a small loading dock for truck or freight car deliveries, even an extra much shorter bay that could have a critter with a little four wheel utility car attached.  I'll kick that around and will welcome suggestions if something strikes somebody.

@Cajonpassfan   Does that help?  Enough?

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[narrowminded]

Why not take the "mock-up" and simply layer materials over it now to finish it off? Add a fascia and rake boards to the end of that nice roof.

Or go down to FEDEX store and have the image printed on their thickest cardstock, cut out the windows, assemble and layer that with the materials of your choice.  Just like some old fashioned architectural models are made.

Or Gallitzin Station, right @chicken45 ?

I hear you but this will be getting changes as it develops, especially with the detailing being considered, and even if it wasn't it will probably be just as easy to make it in styrene as to trying to make good with a flat printed board and batten building instead of one with some actual shape to it.  As far as the roof goes, I don't trust cardboard over time for warping or just being durable enough and remaking that in styrene will actually be pretty easy.  I know how to do it now!  

The general  shape and dimensions won't change as far as I can tell at this point but the details like windows, man doors, possibly some freight type doors and maybe even an addition to the basic building will require changes.  It's an excellent stand in for now and may have to do duty for a while depending on what direction the critter chassis plans take.

And while you're here, do you have any thoughts on the placement?

[Chris333]

Since we are talking EM-1's does anyone still have them for sale?

I like the engine house at an angle you could add a boiler house off the side too.

[narrowminded]

Since we are talking EM-1's does anyone still have them for sale?

I like the engine house at an angle you could add a boiler house off the side too.

EM-1's?  If the usual suspects don't have any you might try Esthers Hobby Shop in Pittsburgh.  It seems to me he had some a few months ago.

And thanks for the input.  The original Thurmond engine house had an old loco boiler mounted inside the house in one of the extreme corners.  It might be possible to do a small leanto area in that pie section at the end.  Closed ends with open face or just enclosed.  As long as it doesn't get too cluttered.  A small pile of coal and how it got there should be addressed too.

I hope to do a little drawing later tonight making a few pieces to mock up different options.   

[Cajonpassfan]

I understand it is too late to cut the layout edge, but it would have made a wonderful scene along the house....

In this instance, the parallel placement doesn't bother me, it fits in with the town and Main Street layout. Setting it at an angle just seems to calls too much attention to itself, for no apparent reason. I like things to fit in their context, and here the parallel placement works for me.

Another thought (drumroll): the EM-1's came decades after the engine house was built; I'd let the tail end hang out of the house and call it a day. A smaller, shorter house would fit its surroundings better I would think. Besides, what fun is it to watch a beautiful locomotive entirely hidden inside? There's plenty examples of modern power not fitting inside their houses, Santa Fe being one, see pics. (Yes I know it's cold in WV ) but you're not modeling winter, right?

One more drumroll: If you were a bit masochistic, you could also model a partial house; cut it at the end of the layout  and have some wonderful views of the truss work and interiors details, like the pic below...
I enjoy creating work for others...

Otto K.

[narrowminded]

Thanks, Otto  
I have considered the cut off building and separately the super detailed interior and I like both ideas.  If this were a module I'd strongly consider it.  As a full board and with all of its compromises and the time I want to invest at this point that will have to wait.  I still may detail heavily but I'm not sure that the windows will give sufficient interior view to make it worthwhile.  I will likely still put service pits in it just in case and they will be visible somewhat through the open doors.  Then, if I get the urge and depending on how much can actually be seen through the windows I may detail it more and can do it without pressure to get it done.

Aided by your suggestion and playing with the parts, I've reduced the angle of the building so it's not so pronounced as the first photos.  Your point on the unnecessarily dramatic part I think was correct but there is still a very boring look to it all when it sits parallel with the side and I think that effect is more pronounced in person than in the photos.  Playing with it I found just a little bit of angle accomplishes everything needed to kill that boring effect and I think it looks better than sharply angled.  There are some photos of that as well as some addition options that I will put in a new post.  Thanks for your interest and time, Otto.  It's helpful.

[narrowminded]

I printed up a couple of addition pieces and played some more with the placement of the new engine house mock up.  This will have the third rail coming down the left side of the building instead of the right as the original engine house was and will sit pretty much as in these pics barring some good advice otherwise.   What I would be interested in is opinions on the additions, whether the longer or shorter and also any more ideas in the direction of completing the scene. 

I've got a couple of options at this point and not really sure which way I want to go.  The longer addition could be fitted with doors and tracks for an additional smaller bay or just left as shop area.  The shop area part might make more sense than another bay especially if it's supposed to have service capabilities.  The shorter could be shop or maybe some warehousing space with some freight doors.  On either, there would be windows and man doors placed as needed which aren't printed in the mock ups.

Shop or no, there could be some kind of dock outside, running along the side of the tracks away from the building.  It could be narrow with a ramp to ground, larger and maybe with a small boom crane mounted, or...  These are just a few ideas that have struck me but this will require some more mock up parts for me to decide.

Any thoughts or opinions on these items or on the general placement would be welcome.  Thanks for looking.

And the pics:

The first two show the reduced angle.

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And these show the additions, long or short.

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[Cajonpassfan]

Fair enough. But if you find the front edge boring (it is) what a perfect place to store or pile on assorted railroad junk?
You may even have the room to put in a short dummy spur running off the edge...
And either of the additions work for me, with the smaller one perhaps a little better in overall proportion?
I wouldn't sweat so much...it's all good now.
Otto

[narrowminded]

Fair enough. But if you find the front edge boring (it is) what a perfect place to store or pile on assorted railroad junk?
You may even have the room to put in a short dummy spur running off the edge...
And either of the additions work for me, with the smaller one perhaps a little better in overall proportion?

Otto

Thanks Otto.

I agree on the proportions.  The addition adds interest, I think.   The large is just a little too big and the extra length doesn't seem to add anything to the interest while the short is just a little too short, I think, so I will try one more with an extra 1/2" length.  I think it will be just right to my eye and leave sufficient siding room for a loco or a flat or box car or two that could be  being unloaded or minor servicing.  I will also fool around with a loading dock that might serve the rail side as well as truck on the opposite side, both with access to the building.  The track in that section will have boards between the rails making it level for carts or just working on things.  That's kind of my thinking at this point.  Mock ups to follow. 

I started looking at the track work that will need redone.  It will start with the last turnout coming from the yard.  It will be similar to what's there but needs alignment tweaks to fit.

That right side may get a salvaged train boiler for shop steam (as per Thurmond) under an awning or maybe enclosed.  I'll see what it looks like as I go and can add or subtract to my heart's content, including railroad junk.

[narrowminded]

Here are some more pics with a "medium" length addition and a loading dock to serve the engine house by rail or truck.  It's still mock up stage but it's the general idea.  Good for drums of stuff, pallets or boxes of train parts, etc.  The mock ups are helping me see it and I'm pretty much liking it.   Needs some man doors, steps to the dock, and proper freight doors.  The area off the dock will be employee parking and truck access.  Tracks, paving (or gravel lot), and whatever, will all end at the board edge as a sliced through cut off, I think.  Any suggestions welcome!

[narrowminded]

Some track and switches arrived.  Styrene board and batten sheet still due this week.  Doesn't mean I'll start work as I'm setup for machining now but you never know.

One thing I'm looking at is a manual switch operator for these code 55 switches.  I'm not enamored with the slide switches and this board has frog juicers so... Maybe an operating switch stand so there's ready visual indication, too.

[OldEastRR]

The slanted enginehouse looks much better -- too much "boring RR layout arrangement look" with everything parallel to layout edges. One thing to make a sort of symmetry: make the angle of the enginehouse the same and parallel to the angle the station is. It ties together the RR property as having the same surveying baselines for construction of the station and house, different for the baseline used for the town.