CESM - "Darth Vader" Signals Available

[dcutting]

David ..the decoder board I assume accepts standard NMRA switch commands from the bus?  Will it work with JMRI CATS?  It might be more cost effective than getting another digitrax board

Hmmm. I’m not sure what you mean. CATS is more of a software package. Essentially these decoders are set up with two pins that take power and signals off the DCC bus. If that can work with CATS, I don’t see why not.

David

[Philip H]

So with the decoder holder how are you moving soldering to the workbench? Is the holder meant to sit below an installed signal head or be its base?

[dcutting]

So with the decoder holder how are you moving soldering to the workbench? Is the holder meant to sit below an installed signal head or be its base?

So essentially the signal gets built on the workbench and installed on top of the sigDock. Then a hole is drilled in the layout, the sigDock is inserted, and then the decoder is plugged in from underneath the layout.

David

[peteski]

The mast is actually prototypical scaled... it’s a 1/16” brass tube, usually the masts were pretty large on these.

Wow!  10" diameter masts?  That is very stout!

[GaryHinshaw]

The wait is over.
...
Pre-orders should extend to January 1st, 2017. I'm pretty confident I can reach the relatively low minimums needed to make these happen.

These look very promising, especially the heads, but I have several questions:

* What do you mean by "The wait is over"?  Are all the components subject to pre-order?  Just the heads?  Decoders?  Your web site is unclear about this.  And do you mean Jan 2018, not Jan 2017?  If you get enough pre-orders before then, will you go to production?

* Does the model photo above show the pre-production 1.6 mm thick head, or the production 0.5 mm head?

* I'm not really grasping what the base contraption does.  Do you have any photos of a sample installation?

* Is stainless really the best choice for the snow shields? I'd imagine that phosphor bronze would be nicer to roll and better at taking paint.  Also the hood seems to short to me, compared, e.g., to one of the photos on your site:



Above all, thank you for taking this project on!

-gfh

P.S. I am going to merge the two Vader threads, to minimize redundant traffic.

[dcutting]

Wow!  10" diameter masts?  That is very stout!

That's what the BLMA HO scale masts were when I measured them. You can really use whatever diameter tube you want.

1) What do you mean by "The wait is over"?  Are all the components subject to pre-order?  Just the heads?  Decoders?  Your web site is unclear about this.  And do you mean Jan 2018, not Jan 2017?  If you get enough pre-orders before then, will you go to production?

2) Does the model photo above show the pre-production 1.6 mm thick head, or the production 0.5 mm head?

3) I'm not really grasping what the base contraption does.  Do you have any photos of a sample installation?

4) Is stainless really the best choice for the snow shields? I'd imagine that phosphor bronze would be nicer to roll and better at taking paint.  Also the hood seems to short to me, compared, e.g., to one of the photos on your site:

I've numbered your questions to make my responses more clear.

1) All components are on pre-order. Production will begin at the latest January 2018, earlier if the order volume is high.

2) The model shows the 1.6 mm head. It is rather thick... the 0.5 mm is about as thin as it gets without the craziness of flex PCBs which would have other issues.

3) Here's a few renders of what the base parts look like... with the signal attached.

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The purple thing is the PCB, while the white thing is a plastic tube. The grey parts are 3D printed. The signal mast can slide in and out of the hole on the top of the piece for maintenance purposes, and extra lengths of magnet wire are contained within the white tube, enough to lay the signal on its side.

4) I chose stainless because it will stand up to lots of abuse. The rest of the parts have to be stainless for stability as well. The hoods do look short though. I will have them corrected for the production frets.

[GaryHinshaw]

Thanks very much for the clarifications David.  The render helps a lot, but I still have a few questions:

1. How does this eliminate the need for under-layout soldering?  Are the magnet wires soldered to a plug that can be mated to the board via the bottom piece? Is the plug small enough to fit through the user-supplied plastic tubing, or is there some other assembly sequence that I'm missing?

2. What is the role of the top piece?  Is there a reason to make it so large?  It would seem to require a large diameter hole be drilled in the layout to accommodate it.

Cheers,
-gfh

[peteski]

Gary, I suspect the top piece is to cover up the hole that was needed to thread the same-diameter bottom plug/connector piece (so you wouldn't need to solder anything under the layout).  How else would you make a large multi-pin connector to be integral with the rest of the signal (without soldering)?

Dave: I do not need any of the signals - I was just commenting on what appeared to be a large diameter mast.  If the 1:1 mast is in fact 10" then all is well. If the real mast is smaller diameter then I was going to ask why not scale it correctly? There are small diameter thin-wall tubes available (either in brass or stainless steel hypodermic tubing).

[GaryHinshaw]

Gary, I suspect the top piece is to cover up the hole that was needed to thread the same-diameter bottom plug/connector piece (so you wouldn't need to solder anything under the layout).  How else would you make a large multi-pin connector to be integral with the rest of the signal (without soldering)?

Right - my question is how the wires mate to the bottom piece.  Are they soldered directly to pins that are captive in the piece, or to separate small plugs that mate with it?  It sounds like the former, but it seems like the latter should be possible.  If so, one might be able to avoid requiring such a large hole in the layout for each signal.  Just thinking out loud...

[dcutting]

Right - my question is how the wires mate to the bottom piece.  Are they soldered directly to pins that are captive in the piece, or to separate small plugs that mate with it?  It sounds like the former, but it seems like the latter should be possible.  If so, one might be able to avoid requiring such a large hole in the layout for each signal.  Just thinking out loud...

Here's the little board:

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Basically the wires are soldered on the middle column of holes, then the headers are installed on either side, one for the decoder and one for expansion should the signal this holds not have three heads. The decoders come with female headers that will then plug into the base. The large hole is required because you need to fit the male headers on the board that goes through the hole in the layout.

David

[peteski]

David, what is the pin spacing of the header? Standard 0.100"? Also, the outside rows of holes seem staggered (not in-line). Do the headers have staggered pins?

[dcutting]

David, what is the pin spacing of the header? Standard 0.100"? Also, the outside rows of holes seem staggered (not in-line). Do the headers have staggered pins?

The pin spacing is 0.1". The outer rows are staggered to employ what is known as a "locking" header. The pins are in line but the holes are offset just perfectly so that the header stays put while you solder it in.

David

[peteski]

The pin spacing is 0.1". The outer rows are staggered to employ what is known as a "locking" header. The pins are in line but the holes are offset just perfectly so that the header stays put while you solder it in.

David

Ah, that makes sense.  I was also wondering why you didn't utilize physically smaller finer-pitch mezzanine-type connectors, but I suspect that those would not be stable enough to support the controller card.

[dcutting]

Ah, that makes sense.  I was also wondering why you didn't utilize physically smaller finer-pitch mezzanine-type connectors, but I suspect that those would not be stable enough to support the controller card.

Not just that, but I wanted to ensure compatibility with 1st generation signal decoders.

[dcutting]

I'm worried. I've had these available for over a month and have received no orders. Several layout builders have approached me with large needs but nothing has been nailed down yet. What am I missing? If I don't get orders I will have no choice but to scrap this project.

David