Author Topic: Are the Athearn and Kato Bethgon Coal Porters the same prototype?  (Read 982 times)

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wcfn100

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I was looking at a TSC conversion for the Athearn Bethgon Coal Porter but see there's no need as I can just use my standard box with a shim.  I need to know the striker distance from the end sill and found a drawing for the Kato car.

If these are the same car, I'll just use the Kato drawing.

Thanks,

Jason

ncbqguy

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Re: Are the Athearn and Kato Bethgon Coal Porters the same prototype?
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2017, 09:22:58 PM »
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Even if they are the same exact prototype different brands will vary in dimensions that matter because of how the models were designed and tooled by different factories.
You'll have to take carefull measurements of the car you want to use...and I'd measure both ends as there might be small variations from one end to the other.
Charlie Vlk

wcfn100

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Re: Are the Athearn and Kato Bethgon Coal Porters the same prototype?
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2017, 09:41:20 PM »
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For my purposes, the model dimensions aren't important except for the couple height.  I'm just curious if I find a drawing for the Kato car in regards to the striker plate distance and coupler pulling face, if I can use that for the Athearn car as well.


Jason

ncbqguy

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Re: Are the Athearn and Kato Bethgon Coal Porters the same prototype?
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2017, 12:14:59 PM »
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"I need to know the striker distance from the end sill...."

Why look at a drawing of a Kato model (2D printouts made for advertising purposes are not accurate for that model... you'd need to have access to the factory 3D files to get close to actual molded dimensions) which will be different than the Athearn execution even of the same prototype.

Unless I'm missing something here I think if you are making a product for the Athearn car it seems logical that you'd want to have one to measure to design the part and confirm the fit before offering it.

Charlie Vlk
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wcfn100

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Re: Are the Athearn and Kato Bethgon Coal Porters the same prototype?
« Reply #4 on: February 11, 2017, 01:35:38 PM »
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Unless I'm missing something here I think if you are making a product for the Athearn car it seems logical that you'd want to have one to measure to design the part and confirm the fit before offering it.


When designing these TSC boxes or adapters, there are two main numbers to know, the prototype striker plate distance from the end sill and the prototype distance to the coupler pulling faces.  From those two numbers I can design a coupler box that will give a prototypical look and correct coupling distance.  I can't get those measurements off the model.   I have some information about the Kato prototype.  If the Athearn car is the same prototype, I can just apply what I have.  I'm sure even if it's not the exact same, it'll be within inches, so this isn't a big deal.  I just though I'd ask.


Jason


NSEGeorge

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Re: Are the Athearn and Kato Bethgon Coal Porters the same prototype?
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2017, 09:58:57 PM »
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the Athearn, Kato, LBF/Hubert/Intermountain, and deLuxe cars are all Johnstown America Bethgon Aluminum Coalporters. There were three assembly variations of the car as of 2012. Don't have any information after that, but i haven't observed any major distinctions. 

The big difference for the prototype is in Eastern version of the car, which were originally made of steel. the 1997 Conrail cars were stainless steel kits delivered to the Holidaysburg,PA shops to use as rebuild parts for some of CR's 14,000 remaining Carbon Steel coal cars. the cars had 11 and 12 panel sides, depending on what year they were rebuilt.

The Aluminum cars are all Bethgon II cars, and that is what was modeled by all of the manufacturers.

Overall Length Over Coupler Pulling Faces    53' 1"
Truck Centers                                           40' 6"
Length (inside)                                           47' 9 1/8"
Height (rail to top of side)                           12' 8 1/2"
Cubic Capacity                                           4,520 Cu.Ft.
Light Weight                                           41,700 Lbs.
Load Limit                                                   244,300 Lbs
Gross Rail Load                                           286,000 Lbs.

For your stated purposes, the prototype distance between cars should be the same.

george
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wcfn100

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Re: Are the Athearn and Kato Bethgon Coal Porters the same prototype?
« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2017, 10:04:20 PM »
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Thanks George.  I still don't have a sill length, but with those numbers, I should have what I need to make something close enough.

Jason
« Last Edit: February 12, 2017, 10:06:04 PM by wcfn100 »