N scale Royal Hudson.... again? Or finally?

[CNR5529]

The flip side is a stock pacific with traction tires can pull quite a few cars. I managed to pull the traction tires off a Kato GG1 that belongs to a friend of mine, when he claimed his GG1 could out-pull any other loco. i won the drawbar pull   

If we can minimize how much material we remove from the pacific, and use a loco with traction tires, it should be able to pull quite a bit. that said, I am in agreement that added weight would be good! My goal is to be able to pull an 18 car consist of the Dominion, which are mostly Geoff Gooderham cars on MT trucks.

[craigolio1]

I have a 10 car consist of Gooderam 2200 coaches that I'll be pulling so I need a good puller too. My original plans, when I started this loco maybe 10 years ago, was to grind the pacific boiler into a rectangle shape and then slide my home made boiler on over that. This would preserve some of the weight and eliminate the need to make a new motor mount. However in speaking with other people who have these locos, it seems to be recommended that the motor be mounted to the chassis. I'm open to either way as long as it works.

Honestly my loco ran very well out of the box when I tested it. However that was on a single straight piece of flex track. Hardly a comprehensive test. Mine is the older version with no traction tires. I just recently contacted the fellow that bought all of Model Power's parts to see if I can get some traction tire equipped wheels. If I can't I'll remove mine and have a groove milled in them and make my own.

That coupled with a tender that has decent all wheel pick up makes this a good loco apparently. But as it is I'm pretty sure it won't pull my train on a flat layout let alone with a helix like I'm planning.

If we stuck with the existing design, but modified the boiler to allow the new shell to fit over top, then we don't need to redesign how the body will attach. It will also make it easier for those who don't have the skills to make a new motor mount to get on board. We can come up with a set of measurements that we need to file the boiler down to, and then the FXD shell can slip on. Easy. For those who want to remotor or make a new motor mount, they can modify it.

Having fewer changes to the chassis design will make the whole thing easier for sure.

[Paradise275]

Thanks Fredrick for rubbings salt in the wound about my GG1. But remember where you got the traction tires for your Model Power Pacific LOL.

Yes, he did pull the traction tires off!

Rick

[craigolio1]

So what you're saying is if I have to mill my own grooves in my wheels, I can use Kato GG1 traction tires, or that they will work as replacements for the MP tires?

Also, I've started the build thread so I would appreciate it if all future discussion about anything to do with actual building or development could be done there.

its linked here, and edited into my original post:

https://www.therailwire.net/forum/index.php?topic=40377.0

Thanks, Craig

[Angus Shops]

Maybe I can help. I have some experience with resin casting...

Geoff

[craigolio1]

Geoff, thanks for joining in!  My consist full of your cars has been awaiting this loco for YEARS!

Instead of everyone having buy a model off of Shapeways, how feasible is it to have the master done in FXD (likely $$$ to print) and then have multiples cast? When I started this up last time, in 2014, Jeff Briggs said he would cast it for us but the cost per unit was as high as An FXD print would be now, and also I understand that he was slowing down his output. I'm not even sure if he's in it anymore.

Knowing your quality work as I do I would be very pleased if you would take an interest in this. Especially if it lead to us coming to an arrangement to have the masters cast.

Craig

[draskouasshat]

Personal opinion here. I think you need to worry about building the model over trying to bring on investors and others for their certain skillset. The more people you have, the more pinions they have, the more certain parts of the midweek didn't come out juuuuuust right. You now have individuals who don't think they got their money's worth.
Take this info from someone who's been around a project like this, hell my model was the master that got brutally destroyed along with expensive kato mikado parts were never returned to me.

Adam Draskovich

[peteski]

Instead of everyone having buy a model off of Shapeways, how feasible is it to have the master done in FXD (likely $$$ to print) and then have multiples cast? When I started this up last time, in 2014, Jeff Briggs said he would cast it for us but the cost per unit was as high as An FXD print would be now, and also I understand that he was slowing down his output.

If you want to make a master for making resin castings (possibly for profit)  it might make sense to take this to another level and have the master printed on a printed which can give much better quality than FXD.  That way you would have almost-injection-molded quality with almost no cleanup of the printed master.

[CNR5529]

So what you're saying is if I have to mill my own grooves in my wheels, I can use Kato GG1 traction tires, or that they will work as replacements for the MP tires?

No, my pacific was stock without TTs and I has having a hard time finding the traction tire replacement wheelset. Rick was able to track down a set for me. I had tried Bullfrog snot, but wasn't too happy with the results. Once the new wheelset was fitted, I repaid him by pulling the TTs off of his GG1 while conducting a tug-o-war drawbar test. oops! We reinstalled them after LOL

BTW installing the replacement wheelset was one of the harder things I've ever had to do on an N scale steamer, and I usually have no problems with tearing locos apart and rebuilding them. Not for the faint of heart. Getting the driver axle wipers to co-operate was a royal PITA, but oh so worth it!

[craigolio1]

 Peteski, thanks for joining in.  My goal is not to make any money on this. Only to produce a good quality model and hopefully reduce the cost theough a group effort. If we have a lot of support and it is economical then I think we should definitely research producing a master of the highest quality.

 My experience with rapid prototyping is minimal. I wasn't aware of anything of higher-quality than FXD. I have heard of people having masters CNC machined but that sounds expensive.  I know that the artefacts of the rapid prototyping process can really show themselves on models with anything but flat surfaces. This locomotive is all curves and so I presume that anything rapid prototyped will need  some clean up prior to casting. I imagine that most modellers will want their finished models smooth, and maybe even shiny. To achieve a paint job like that we need a smooth flat surface. My model had a stainless steel boiler jacket applied and I was considering using self adhesive stainless leaf to create that finish. In that case, it would reduce some very minor blemishes but if I use paint, as most modellers would , any blemishes would show.

[CNR5529]

Yes there is some sanding/prep to do, but I found it to require only minimal effort. For example, here is an image of the balloon top coach fresh out of the bestine soak, and after light sanding, thin priming, second light sanding, re-priming and then painting. The artifacts over the hand brake equipment were removed with a light scraping, and the roof took maybe a few minutes of light sanding to smooth out.



Same here, I want a RH, and if a few others have an easier time putting one together as well, then great. But a model manufacturer I am not... I'll leave that up to the professionals.

It looks like we have a core group of people with complementary skills that should be able to make this project possible: research, 2d design and etchings, 3d design and prints, and casting...

[craigolio1]

No, my pacific was stock without TTs and I has having a hard time finding the traction tire replacement wheelset. Rick was able to track down a set for me. I had tried Bullfrog snot, but wasn't too happy with the results. Once the new wheelset was fitted, I repaid him by pulling the TTs off of his GG1 while conducting a tug-o-war drawbar test. oops! We reinstalled them after LOL

BTW installing the replacement wheelset was one of the harder things I've ever had to do on an N scale steamer, and I usually have no problems with tearing locos apart and rebuilding them. Not for the faint of heart. Getting the driver axle wipers to co-operate was a royal PITA, but oh so worth it!

 I've been doing some research and I am seeing the same thing said by other people. Honestly even though I already own the Model Power Pacific, I'm starting to look more seriously at the Kato C 55 Pacific. It gets hi praise for both pulling ability and reliability. It's a more modern split frame design and won't need any reworking mechanically before we put the body on it. They aren't that expensive as far as locomotives go.   The drivers are the correct size and the valve gear is close enough that it wouldnt need complete reworking either. These are all major advantages. Less time and money spent on re inventing the wheel.

[craigolio1]

Same here, I want a RH, and if a few others have an easier time putting one together as well, then great. But a model manufacturer I am not... I'll leave that up to the professionals.

It looks like we have a core group of people with complementary skills that should be able to make this project possible: research, 2d design and etchings, 3d design and prints, and casting...

My thoughts exactly.

Craig

[wcfn100]

 My experience with rapid prototyping is minimal. I wasn't aware of anything of higher-quality than FXD.

There's much better 3D print quality than Shapeways FXD. 


Jason

[CNR5529]

There's much better 3D print quality than Shapeways FXD. 


Jason

Where should we be looking? Just asking because I don't know the other services. And how does price compare? Thanks.