For Joe from MTL re new couplers

[OldEastRR]

Let's not be too hard on MTL for their PS-1s, standard couplers, or other older cars for that matter. Kadee(MTL) was there for the serious N scaler as far back as 1972, while most if not all other train makers were treating N scale as a toy not worth serious effort. If anything, we should be berating Atlas, Intermountain, Bachmann, Model Power, Athearn and all the rest for taking thirty+ years before they realized that American N scale deserved well-detailed, prototypical-faithful cars. MTL is one reason I didn't quit N scale years ago; KATO's U-30C (1989) brought me back up to full interest again.
I just had to point this out.

[johnb]

... Yeah, they stopped doing that a Looooooong time ago!!!  Long before knuckle couplers be game the standard!

I wonder if they still stock the Rapids truck conversions?.. 

~Ian

I highly doubt that they have more than a dozen in their archives.....

[wmcbride]

Let's not be too hard on MTL for their PS-1s, standard couplers, or other older cars for that matter. Kadee(MTL) was there for the serious N scaler as far back as 1972, while most if not all other train makers were treating N scale as a toy not worth serious effort. If anything, we should be berating Atlas, Intermountain, Bachmann, Model Power, Athearn and all the rest for taking thirty+ years before they realized that American N scale deserved well-detailed, prototypical-faithful cars. MTL is one reason I didn't quit N scale years ago; KATO's U-30C (1989) brought me back up to full interest again.
I just had to point this out.

I remember those Kato U30Cs! Black handrails and all and the coupler conversion to fill that big gap in the front. Those were the days and that engine kept me in the game as well.

[johnb]

I remember those Kato U30Cs! Black handrails and all and the coupler conversion to fill that big gap in the front. Those were the days and that engine kept me in the game as well.

I still run my 1989 Kato U30C, another thing that Kato messed up on it was to put the wrong number on the SP units

[Sokramiketes]

@bbussey can you maybe show an example of that?

I have some older underframes which are offset, but the wrong way (compared to what you're saying).  To compensate for the offset truck, the underframe holes should be more towards the center of the car, but the one's I have are further towards the ends.


Jason

I think you're spinning the truck the wrong way.   

[wcfn100]

I think you're spinning the truck the wrong way.   

Well I'm not an operator, and I am getting older,  but I'm pretty sure which way the coupler is supposed to go. 

Jason

[JoeD]

at the peril of repeating myself, these couplers are an accessory not a replacement.  My intention was go give folks who wanted to do more proto projects the one last big thing they would need.  It's not outside the possibility to continue the engineering evolution and work out ways to make them operational, but that's a discussion for a later date.  These will not mate up with any other coupler out there in a manner you are used to, they are stand alone s for the more adventurous among us. 

Joe

[wmcbride]

at the peril of repeating myself, these couplers are an accessory not a replacement.  My intention was go give folks who wanted to do more proto projects the one last big thing they would need.  It's not outside the possibility to continue the engineering evolution and work out ways to make them operational, but that's a discussion for a later date.  These will not mate up with any other coupler out there in a manner you are used to, they are stand alone s for the more adventurous among us. 

Joe

Well, I'm one of those adventurous ones with three 10-packs on order to see what fits where (I know what now takes a 1015 but want to see about the long vs short shanks)) so I can order more. I've been waiting for something like these for over 25 years...

[learmoia]

Well, I'm one of those adventurous ones with three 10-packs on order to see what fits where (I know what now takes a 1015 but want to see about the long vs short shanks)) so I can order more. I've been waiting for something like these for over 25 years...

Since this is a stand alone - Non Compatible system - I think what we will quickly find that there will need to be some other 'conversions' developed for a full transition to be possible.

And that may mean some dummy couplers.. similar to unimate to fill some of these voids.
-- Or some creative boxes to fit the standard coupler.
-- Kato Locomotives with underslung Couplers.
-- Couplers to fit existing MT Body mount / Truck Boxes..
-- Bluford / ESM cars with custom coupler boxes designed for the 1015.

Once I get my hands on some, I've got some ideas.. But I need to see the measurements of the coupler to know for sure.

This is a great start though, and will fit a-lot of applications. ~Ian

[bbussey]

@bbussey can you maybe show an example of that?

I have some older underframes which are offset, but the wrong way (compared to what you're saying).  To compensate for the offset truck, the underframe holes should be more towards the center of the car, but the one's I have are further towards the ends.

I'm afraid I can't.  I no longer possess any vintage Kadee boxcars or flats/gons.

[wcfn100]

I'm afraid I can't.  I no longer possess any vintage Kadee boxcars or flats/gons.

I found a few Kadee underframes and the 40' standard underframe has the hole centered on the bolster with an offset truck.  The 50' standard box car has the underframe hole offset towards the end of the car but with trucks that have a centered kingpin hole.  The gondola I found is also offset to the end.  I can't be sure that one if the trucks are original.

I've been in N scale a long time and can't recall seeing an MTL underframe that was offset to compensate for the trucks with the offset holes so they lined up with the bolster.  But I certainly haven't owned every car.   I'm interested if anyone has one like this.

Jason

[Cajonpassfan]

at the peril of repeating myself, these couplers are an accessory not a replacement.  My intention was go give folks who wanted to do more proto projects the one last big thing they would need.  It's not outside the possibility to continue the engineering evolution and work out ways to make them operational, but that's a discussion for a later date.  These will not mate up with any other coupler out there in a manner you are used to, they are stand alone s for the more adventurous among us. 

Joe

Joe, this is a great product, and i want to thank you for making it happen for those of us interested in such things. But I'm afraid you'll need to keep repeating yourself, because there are a lot of folks out there who don't get what it is and what it isn't. I read some of the comments on another group and just roll my eyes
Sometimes to get a point across, repetition is necessary...
I do hope you sell a ton of these...
Best, Otto K.

[OldEastRR]

I still run my 1989 Kato U30C, another thing that Kato messed up on it was to put the wrong number on the SP units

And when they came out with the DCC version, I put my old custom-painted and weathered shell on the new chassis. Had to do a little removal of material to fit the new frame, but it was all inside the shell and not visible. I had built my own gap-filling body mount on one end, but I just couldn't give up the truck mounted coupler on the rear. Sold the new shell and new trucks on the old frame. The black box inside the cab had to go, too, so I see through the cab and have lighted interior. Still a great puller.

[jagged ben]

I still run my 1989 Kato U30C, another thing that Kato messed up on it was to put the wrong number on the SP units

Um, not really.  The numbers they used belonged to U30Cs.   Are you talking about phases?  I guess maybe you're right, except for the L-window.

[nkalanaga]

Jason:  If your KD/MT gon has one standard and one extended coupler, they're probably original.  As far as I know, all of the drop-end gons came like that, and I didn't know why until I received a BLMA gon, apparently based on the same prototype.  The end sill, and coupler, do extend further from the end on the B end.  Room of the brakeman?  Trying to keep the brake wheel from getting smashed on sharp industrial curves?  Who knows, but that's why the two truck styles.  Unfortunately. I body mounted all of my couplers years ago, and made them the same on both ends.