On30 ET&WNC R.R.

[davefoxx]

What's your idea of "finishing?" Something like drywall-finished walls and ceiling or with a suspended system to reasonably match other parts of the house or are you making it look not so stark (you'll still going to know you're in a basement)? Your ceiling looks sort of low, and trying to frame a soffit or box for that beam will leave a potential clearance issue (this may be one of those places for a "theatrical-style black paint job on the joists, beam, etc and make things "disappear").

Some would say move the sewer line between the joists but that is expensive and I can see that you have other stuff in the way to get over the steel beam. For the best look, a framed out wall in front with maybe some slight notches (don't want to introduce too much weakness) . For your your cleanout , I think framing out an space is best, but instead of a closet you could just put a access door/hatch in and that would preserve access, require no modifications if you move, and limit the footprint. Alternatively, where the pipe is you could just paint everything a common color or partially frame the layout area with furring strips up to the pipe to support a backdrop (this is where the degree of finish comes in). You could always have the backdrop attached to the layout itself to more of less block the pipe view if you just painted the wall. Maybe the layout area is in more of a mechanical space (as you mentioned moving the WH to fit the N layout) so its more of paint and basic treatments and you finish the rest of the basement off more as living space.

Initially, my idea of finishing was drywall, suspended ceiling, and commercial style carpeting.  But, Chris has me thinking about only finishing what's seen.  I'm not worried about finishing off this area of the basement for resale.  There's already a finished area in our basement just outside this room.  I could always just take down what I build or leave it for the next homeowner to finish.

I still think I want a suspended ceiling, because I really need to sort out the lighting in the room.  The previous homeowners have a half-dozen fluorescent fixtures scattered around the room.  I'd love to clean that up and possibly convert to LED lighting.  Plus, a ceiling would minimize dust raining down from the underside of the first floor above.

Thinking about this further, I could build wall sections and drywall them.  But, I would not build the closet and just use the hardboard to bridge the wall sections in the corner around the sewer and water meter.  Install the wall angle of the ceiling grid on the drywall and then install the hardboard after the ceiling, allowing it to curve under the grid and hide that corner.  The layout will hide the underparts.

Thanks, guys!
DFF

[davefoxx]

Put the ceiling in first. Attach the metal L pieces direct to the studs. Then 4x8 hardboard up against the metal grid. Fill in the lower area with drywall.

You can also screw into the studs like a big shelf bracket to support the layout.

I like this idea, too!  You've got me thinking, Chris!  Thank you!

DFF

[davefoxx]

I ordered some track this morning online: another set of six pieces of Micro Engineering Code 83 On30 flextrack and six Code 83 #5 turnouts (three left-hand and three right-hand).  That should get me enough track to lay down the roundy-round portion of the layout.

But, I'll also be able to use these track pieces to do some actual track planning.  For example, I'm using a supposed G scale track plan and converting it to On30.  The word on the street is that Furlow's G scale plan was way too optimistic about what would fit in G scale on the 10' x 12' plan.  I'm hoping, however, that I can use this footprint for a similar On30 track plan.  I need to make some alteration to the plan for interest and operations, though.  I also need to determine the minimum radius.  I'm going to start with 18" as a minimum.  Bachmann suggests a 22" minimum radius for the ten wheelers, but they are running well on the Kato HO scale Unitrack with a 16-⁷/₈" radius that I have, including being coupled to other rolling stock and running forward and reverse.

I was hoping to get to the home center today for some 2"x4"s and other building materials to start building wall sections in the On30 portion of the layout room.  But, I'm not feeling 100% this morning, so that, unfortunately, that may not happen.

DFF

[Dave V]

Awesome, Dave!  I'm holding off on any further track purchases for my HOn3 venture pending my move in April.

As for your basement finish, is there an appreciable chance you may find yourself selling that house in the next few years?  I would just caution that in that case the mods you make shouldn't be too extreme or too model-railroad specific.  Any changes you make that would not appeal to your average buyer should be easy to revert.

In the history of Furlow project railroads, I think the only one that actually fit the advertised space was the Carbondale Central because it used all sectional track.

One other observation...  As I'm track planning in HOn3 with an 18-19" minimum radius, I'm still disoriented by how much space turnouts take up in larger scales.  An On30 #5 takes up even more space I would assume.

[davefoxx]

Awesome, Dave!  I'm holding off on any further track purchases for my HOn3 venture pending my move in April.

As for your basement finish, is there an appreciable chance you may find yourself selling that house in the next few years?  I would just caution that in that case the mods you make shouldn't be too extreme or too model-railroad specific.  Any changes you make that would not appeal to your average buyer should be easy to revert.

This room is basically just an unfinished workshop/storage room at one end of our basement.  The middle 50% of the basement space is finished, so the layout room, whether finished or not, should not cause any significant problems for future resale.  That said, I'm only planning on stud walls, drywall, and suspended ceiling for the permanent mods.  Any of that should not detract future buyers.  I am going to forego the closet, as suggested by Chris.  In other words, take the layouts out and you'll left with a room that is mostly drywalled.  I'm also planning to work on the On30 half of the room first, so I can begin construction of the On30 layout.  The N scale half of the room can happen as money and time allow.  Since I didn't sell the Seaboard Central 2.0, I still have an N scale layout that will be pushed into that end of the room and will tide me over until the On30 is up and running.

In the history of Furlow project railroads, I think the only one that actually fit the advertised space was the Carbondale Central because it used all sectional track.

This is a huge concern for me.  The track plan that I'm following doesn't really have a scale plan, and, truthfully, Furlow only built dioramas for the article.  The layout was never built to the best of my knowledge, and I'm not sure that it could have even been built in its designed space in G scale.

One other observation...  As I'm track planning in HOn3 with an 18-19" minimum radius, I'm still disoriented by how much space turnouts take up in larger scales.  An On30 #5 takes up even more space I would assume.

Yeah, like you, I am unfamiliar with trackplanning in the larger scales, which is why I ordered some track to see what I can fit into the space.  I need the #5s to see how they fit, and I'll probably get a large roll of paper and work on the floor.  Just from pictures, though, I have already figured out how to shorten the turnouts, not unlike how I have chopped up N scale Atlas #5s.

DFF

[Chris333]

You can print out Fast tracks On30 templates:
http://www.handlaidtrack.com/assets/downloads/tt-on30-t-5.pdf

There was also that article in MRP about the Furlow G trackplan mods. I think they just added a run-around track.

If you think turnouts are big wait till you start structures 

[davefoxx]

You can print out Fast tracks On30 templates:
http://www.handlaidtrack.com/assets/downloads/tt-on30-t-5.pdf

Thanks!

There was also that article in MRP about the Furlow G trackplan mods. I think they just added a run-around track.

Coincidentally, when I went looking for that issue this morning while I was placing the order for track, I found that I have every issue of MRP from 1995 through 2017 . . . except the 1998 issue, which is the one on the Soda Creek & South Park RR revisited.  Which means I already referred to that issue at some point and somehow misplaced it.    So, I cannot confirm all of the improvements to the track plan as I type this, but a passing siding was among the changes.

If you think turnouts are big wait till you start structures 

Thankfully, for me, this is Appalachian narrow gauge railroading when the ET&WNC was hanging on by a shoestring budget in a very poor post-Depression era setting, so I'm not going to have a lot of structures, nor any huge industries.  Besides, this is the look I'm going for (deep in the Blue Ridge):



DFF

[davefoxx]

Awesome!  I found an ET&WNC documentary on YouTube.  I know what I'm going to be doing for the next forty-five minutes or so.

Enjoy!
DFF

EDIT: Another ET&WNC video!  The first is the WWII years, this second video is the final years (around 1949-50):

[Chris333]

There wasn't much changed:

[Dave V]

To have made that trackplan work in G scale, you'd be talking 4-foot diameter curves...the smallest radius LGB track.  That's the track you see those stubby little German tank engines running on with the coaches that have only three windows on each side.

The Bachmann Big Hauler will run on those curves but she won't be happy and she'll look like a fat drunk doing it.

[eric220]

On the other hand, the depicted LGB moguls and coaches were designed to run on those curves. I don't think they look horrible, but they don't look great either. The pilot overhang is the worst offense.

[davefoxx]

There wasn't much changed:

Thanks for posting that, Chris.  The obvious revisions that I see:

1) The passing siding added and moving the crossover in "Soda Creek" (adding flexibility to ops);
2) The two- to three-track hidden staging yard (this is a huge addition for obvious reasons); and
3) The second track at the tipple in "Furlow (adding capacity)."

The things I like about this plan are (1) the wye with some switching potential, (2) the staging yard to hide additional motive power and rolling stock, and (3) the small branchlike to the tipple.  Those are features that I want to have in my final plan.

That said, there are elements of the track plan in the July 1981 MR article on the ET&WNC that I would love to include.  Trust me, I know that I cannot fit this plan into my basement without significant revision and (probably) losing the N scale layout:



DFF

[Chris333]

With such a small layout (for O scale) I would skip the standard gauge and 3-rail.

I got a bunch of hits on the NG&SLG DVD if you need any plans. Just printed out their coal car plans 

[Dave V]

With such a small layout (for O scale) I would skip the standard gauge and 3-rail.

I got a bunch of hits on the NG&SLG DVD if you need any plans. Just printed out their coal car plans 

Depends on what segment Dave's modeling since the western part was dual-gauged.  But I think what Chris is getting at is that for as much challenge as you'll have fitting in the narrow gauge track you want...it'll be almost impossible to cram trackage with operable dual-gauge in that space.

[SSW7771]

Awesome!  I found an ET&WNC documentary on YouTube.  I know what I'm going to be doing for the next forty-five minutes or so.

Enjoy!
DFF

EDIT: Another ET&WNC video!  The first is the WWII years, this second video is the final years (around 1949-50):

That first video was very interesting. Some nice shots.