Problems with our new GMD-1

[Jeff AKA St0rm]

Has anyone else noticed that there wheels are out of gage? I ran mine for the first time at home today on Atlas Code 55 and i noticed they climb the frogs. Out comes the wheel gage and they are all too narrow. After reading the Rapido instruction on there website to get the shell off took the couplers out and the shell does not just fall off as the instruction said it should. I dont want to pull to hard but with normal wiggling nothing happened. Mike help on getting the shell off??

Jeff

[mark dance]

I just picked up my two sound-equipped, orange nose units at Central this morning.  Sound is great.  Speed matching is great.   They look beautiful but...

I consist and couple them together and they fight each other.  Whenever there is the slightest speed hesitation or change in one unit it seems to "kick" the other one which fights it back causing the original one to react and so on, and so on...

From my adaptive control theory days it feels like feedback from one is causing the other to speed up which then causes the other to try and slow everything down, and so on.  I have never used decoder BEMF settings or played with them but from my understanding of how this mode is intended to work - such understanding possibly quite flawed - this feedback might be causing them to fight.  But I could not see from the downloaded Loksound manual how to turn BEMF off. CV 49 seems to turn on something called "load control" and CVs 54-56 modify it...is that it?

Mike et al.  Help! I bought them to run them together and they are basically unusable as they sit.  Please note I have not run them in yet but when consisted together but *not* coupled together they seem to perform pretty well through the speed range I will run them at (0-30 mph)

thx

md

[Jeff AKA St0rm]

Yes Mark load control is the same thing. I tried to mess around with it in JMRI but all it did was make the loco not start moving until speed steep 20 and then jump to like 20 smph. I have not had time to sit down and really look at the cv's and speed tables to see if i can fix them. I am planing to spend some time working on programing them tomorrow. If i figure anything out I will post my findings. I have also sent Mike a msg about it that he said he was going to pass on.

Jeff

[craigolio1]

Has anyone else noticed that there wheels are out of gage? I ran mine for the first time at home today on Atlas Code 55 and i noticed they climb the frogs. Out comes the wheel gage and they are all too narrow. After reading the Rapido instruction on there website to get the shell off took the couplers out and the shell does not just fall off as the instruction said it should. I dont want to pull to hard but with normal wiggling nothing happened. Mike help on getting the shell off??

Jeff

To get the shell off, remove the couplers, pop the handrails off the cab, and use a little screw driver to push the tabs out that are accessible once the couplers are out.  They are at the front and rear on the ends of the shell.  Once you push those tabs up through the walkway the shell comes off with little effort.

Craig

[Joetrain59]

Got my undec loco from BLW today. "Silent" version running on DC layout. Headlights on, ran very smooth right out of box, even slow speeds. At first, I was bit perturbed as many detail parts need to be added, including handrails and glazing. But very quickly realized it makes painting easier due to less dismantling.
 No illuminated # boards? Oh well. One bitch I have is with the MTL couplers, they droop. I've brought this up before with Z905's. Haven't checked them against gauge, or wheels for that matter. But running fine as I type on Peco C55.
 Thank you Rapido.
 Joe D
Full assembly instructions on Rapido site? Pud, Jason or Mike, can you post a link to them.
 Jason, get over the fact that some modelers will NEVER go DCC.   

[jdcolombo]

I just picked up my two sound-equipped, orange nose units at Central this morning.  Sound is great.  Speed matching is great.   They look beautiful but...

I consist and couple them together and they fight each other.  Whenever there is the slightest speed hesitation or change in one unit it seems to "kick" the other one which fights it back causing the original one to react and so on, and so on...

From my adaptive control theory days it feels like feedback from one is causing the other to speed up which then causes the other to try and slow everything down, and so on.  I have never used decoder BEMF settings or played with them but from my understanding of how this mode is intended to work - such understanding possibly quite flawed - this feedback might be causing them to fight.  But I could not see from the downloaded Loksound manual how to turn BEMF off. CV 49 seems to turn on something called "load control" and CVs 54-56 modify it...is that it?

Mike et al.  Help! I bought them to run them together and they are basically unusable as they sit.  Please note I have not run them in yet but when consisted together but *not* coupled together they seem to perform pretty well through the speed range I will run them at (0-30 mph)

thx

md

Try setting CV 56 to 128.

John C.

[Jeff AKA St0rm]

To get the shell off, remove the couplers, pop the handrails off the cab, and use a little screw driver to push the tabs out that are accessible once the couplers are out.  They are at the front and rear on the ends of the shell.  Once you push those tabs up through the walkway the shell comes off with little effort.

Craig

I was going to try that but one of the 4 handrails on the cab is glued in and i don't want to break it off just yet 

Full assembly instructions on Rapido site? Pud, Jason or Mike, can you post a link to them.

http://www.rapidotrains.com/support_gmd1n.html

[mark dance]

Try setting CV 56 to 128.

John C.

Thank you for the suggestion John. I changed the CV value to 128 per your recommendation. It was 255.before. While performance of the consisted units seems slightly better once they start to fight (oscillate) it just gets worse and worse. Is there any way just to turn this PID loop off altogether?

Md

[Jeff AKA St0rm]

OK i got the shell off. How do i get the trucks out so i can gage the wheels?

[Puddington]

Procedure for trucks is posted on our website...

http://www.rapidotrains.com/support_gmd1n.html

We are still awaiting some feedback from Digitrax on some issues - will post as soon as we hear back from them.... sorry for the delay gang.

Dan is looking at the consisting issue - will report back.

[Puddington]

 No illuminated # boards? Oh well.

My decision.... we just couldn't fit it in.... as others have noted it's packed in under there. Something had to give; that was "what gave"... sorry.... I will "fess up" to being one of those out there who thinks a lot of lit numberboards glow too bright but the reason was we just didn't have room to make everything work.

[Joetrain59]

Thanks Pud,
   Haven't removed shell, so excuse me. Going to check wheel gauge now, and MT's to their gauge.
 Pud, my GF and I met you at Springfield last year. Took pix of this loco then, and posted them here.
 Joe D
 
Wheels and couplers OK.  Wonder how Z905's will work out?

[jdcolombo]

Thank you for the suggestion John. I changed the CV value to 128 per your recommendation. It was 255.before. While performance of the consisted units seems slightly better once they start to fight (oscillate) it just gets worse and worse. Is there any way just to turn this PID loop off altogether?

Md

Yes, you can turn BEMF off.  Set CV49 to 18 (the default should be 19; turning bit 0 off turns off the BEMF circuit).  I think you may need to cycle power (lift the engine off the track, then put it back on) to make this change.

Another thing you can do is adjust CV's 52 and 54.   CV 54's default is 48; try entering half that (24) and see if it helps.  Also, try reducing CV52 from 32 (it's default) to something like 10.  Given the speeds you are having trouble with, adjusting the slow-speed motor performance (which is what CV's 52 and 54 will do) might resolve your problem.  Worth a try, anyway, and if that doesn't work, you can reset to the defaults and turn off BEMF in CV49.

John

[mark dance]

Alright, I can report success.

Thanks for your help John however no amount of fiddling with the CVs manually helped.  And turning off the first bits in their CV 49s just caused the locos to stop moving altogether (though sound responded as if they were).

What did work was following the automatic Load Control (BEMF) adjustment procedures in the LokSound manual (and repeated to me by the Loksound Yahoo group.  They work very very well together now.

Basically you set CV54 to zero, then put the loco back on the track and hit F1.  The loco will tear off at full speed in the direction it is set for for about 3-4' then stop.  At that point it will have set the CV's as it sees appropriate for the loco. 

Mike et. al.: if you guys aren't doing this simple calibration in the factory or before shipping I strongly suggest you do if my problem with both sound-equipped units is not unique.

NICE Locos!  (Well done Rapido...and yes the gauge on the wheels is too tight and I have had a few shorts on my un-modified Peco code 55s electrofrogs.  I don't look forward to disassembling these locos...)

md

[Jeff AKA St0rm]

So i tried CV 54 and it did make them run better together but it also cut the top end speed to 33 smph. I always program my locos to go 30 smph at 50% and 60 smph at 100% so it looks like i still have some programming to do. anyone else with any ideas? i only need these locos to run together as they will only run with each other but the speed need to come up.

Jeff