Atlas's "Open Letter"

[thomasjmdavis]

Good lord, Jeff, how many sheets of plywood does it take to hold all that?

Good to know that Atlas has its supply chain repaired.  This will be good news for all of those who have put their layout plans on hold.

And thanks for the letter.  I had not heard any of the rumors, yet, but in this day and age, it seems like things can become "fact" in the course of the afternoon on social media, so glad they got out in front on this.

[daniel_leavitt2000]

Yeah, I think I will have a similar shipment soon.

I can't stand waiting for the flex to show up at Modeltrainstuff. I need two more cases of it to start along with 40 or so #7 switches.

God help me when the #10s come in.

[pogopod]

I need a bunch of c55 flex. Can't wait for LHS to be in stock.

[eagle5473]

With all the offshore issues that most manufacturers have had, maybe its time that Atlas brought their tooling home to the US.  Why cant US companies make this stuff here in America?  Cost? what is the labor time on 1 locomotive?  Less than 1 hour I would suspect for manufacturing.  All the labor intensive design and research (I think) is already done in the US.  Maybe Bryan can shed light on just how much US manufacturing would add to a normal car or locomotive?

Aaron Hodge

[Albert in N]

RE: USA factory suggestion, Micro-Trains cars are made in the good old USA and prices compare to imported model railroad cars.  I still have some Atlas, ConCor, and MDC freight cars that I purchased in the early 1990s made in the USA.  Compare apples to apples by looking at MSRP pricing today between M-T and imported items.  Straying from N scale to Lionel Trains, I remember their new stuff prices increased when Lionel started importing from China after closing their USA factory.  Still, N scale has always been an importer's game.  Remember the old (1960s and 1970s) English OOO (Lone Star) and later Rapido and MiniTrix (Germany) N scale?  Then we had the Rivarossi (Italy), Mehano (Yugoslavia), Roco (Austria), Sansui (spelling?, Kato-Japan), and Bachmann (China) products.  Micro-Trains used to be Kadee N and always was made here.  Let the market decide!  I have purchased Atlas products made in various countries over the years and will continue to do so.  Atlas always seems to produce the road names and models that tempt me, plus they run well compared to competition.

[peteski]

This "bring production back to US" sentiment is brought up every time the discussion about production develops.  While I would love to see that happen myself, it is not going to happen.  I have read lots of detailed explanations as to why this will not happen. anytime soon.

I also used to make the argument that Micro Trains makes their models in US. But how about their FT locos?  Mechanisms are made in China.  So much for American made.

No matter how much modelers pine for the production to be brought back to the US - it is not happening. Period!

[CBQ Fan]

This "bring production back to US" sentiment is brought up every time the discussion about production develops.  While I would love to see that happen myself, it is not going to happen.  I have read lots of detailed explanations as to why this will not happen. anytime soon.

I also used to make the argument that Micro Trains makes their models in US. But how about their FT locos?  Mechanisms are made in China.  So much for American made.

No matter how much modelers pine for the production to be brought back to the US - it is not happening. Period!

If it would lead to more profit it would have already been done.  I mean really, who would pick to work with China if the U.S. was equal or lessor cost to produce their products!  Can we auto delete the comments anytime someone complains about bring production back. 

[jagged ben]

RE: USA factory suggestion, Micro-Trains cars are made in the good old USA and prices compare to imported model railroad cars.  I still have some Atlas, ConCor, and MDC freight cars that I purchased in the early 1990s made in the USA.  Compare apples to apples by looking at MSRP pricing today between M-T and imported items.  ...

It's really not apples to apples.

First, MT has a stock of tooling going back some four decades which they have long since amortized.   In other words, they don't have to include the same costs for tooling and design in their MSRP.  And with monthly releases, they have the cash flow to pay for new body styles with profits on their existing body styles.  Not the same for relative newcomers or those (e.g. Atlas) whose legacy tooling is not up to today's standards.

Second, MT hasn't gone the direction of several of the other manufacturers in having more etched metal details and precise prototypical variations.   Comparing a BLMA 89' flat car to an MT 89' flat, or an Intermountain Trinity hopper with the etched metal roofwalk to an MT offering...  It's not apples to apples, either from a modeling quality point of view or a manufacturing labor cost point of view.

Third, even if a US factory produces competitively priced products "apples to apples", you have to consider the capital costs of setting up new US manufacturing if you are a manufacturer who doesn't currently have that and is contracting with China.  So US manufacturing would probably have to be significantly cheaper to justify moving manufacturing to the US when you've never had it there.

One more thing, and this is in no way to insult anyone at MT or in Talent, Oregon, where they have their factory.  But look up the per capita income of that place compared to the US in general.  We are not talking about jobs that will make anyone rich, or even support a family, or raise the average income of the US.  Setting up a new factory for model trains in this country is something that involves hard choices about where, who, and how much. 

[Albert in N]

Apples to apples comparison is admittedly a trite old expression.  I merely wanted to point out that USA-made freight cars are not necessarily overpriced compared to imported freight cars.  Most manufacturers use dies and templates for extended periods.  Yes, N scale locomotives are imported, as they always have been.  Remember the USA-made ads by ConCor for their 1990s Alco PA and EMD E-8 locomotives?  Sure, they may have been assembled here, but parts were imported.  ConCor E-8 body shells looked exactly like my old Atlas Rivarossi E-8 purchased with my first N scale set in 1969.  The ConCor mechanisms were mostly Kato, which was OK.  Sure, I bought a couple and ran them for years and enjoyed them.   Like it or not, globalization is here and has been around a long time in N scale.  In the mid 1970s, my Austrian-built Atlas GP-9 diesels were state-of-the-art and good runners.  Yet, I would not want to revert back to them.  My recent Atlas Chinese-made GP-7s and other diesels are superior to the old ones from 20 or more years ago.  Right now, I am tempted by the newest Atlas GP-9 TT in SP black widow.   A plus selling feature is Atlas parts service, plus their outstanding scale speed control, super detailing and quality control.  Also, I like the fact that Atlas gives their customer a choice between installed DCC or DC-ready for us MRC Direct Current operators. 

[bbussey]

US-made rolling stock does not have the same level of intricacy that imported rolling stock has.  If it did, it would be far more costly.  All of the US-made rolling stock either have press-fit parts in order to reduce labor cost, and/or additional detail parts included for the consumer to apply.  All imported rolling stock have detail parts cemented in place.  MTL rolling stock uses plastic wheels.  All imported rolling stock newly-tooled over the last three years have metal wheels and body-mounted couplers, both of which are an added cost due to materials, labor, or both.

It's not apples to apples.

[eric220]

Can we add "bring tooling and production back to the U.S." right after "politics" on the list of verboden topics?

[Jeff AKA St0rm]

Can we add "bring tooling and production back to the U.S." right after "politics" on the list of verboden topics?

+1

[CodyO]

Can we add "bring tooling and production back to the U.S." right after "politics" on the list of verboden topics?

THEN what would we talk about?!

Model trains?!

[daniel_leavitt2000]

Just remember that MTL track is made in china because the sales price is too low to allow American production. America is great at "dumping" production down. That is actually a compliment... we are good at making a complex product easy to assemble and produce with very high quality and reliability. What we are not good at is stuff too easy (track) or too finicky (individual free standing details) to produce at a consistent quality and price to make it worth while.

[CBQ Fan]

Can we add "bring tooling and production back to the U.S." right after "politics" on the list of verboden topics?

Please make this so!!