Author Topic: Close the book on the CC SW1500...  (Read 2783 times)

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wcfn100

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Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« on: August 28, 2014, 08:19:43 PM »
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Okay, so I don't know if it's still open, but it does still come up from time to time.

Here's the drawing of the SW1500 that was published in the 1966 Car and Locomotive Cyclopedia (this is the same publication that many of our freight cars have come from).






Jason





Philip H

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2014, 08:35:14 PM »
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Ok I'll bite - since the Con-Cor SW was debunked as a 1500 years ago, what are you saying exactly?
Philip H.
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wcfn100

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2014, 09:01:36 PM »
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Ok I'll bite - since the Con-Cor SW was debunked as a 1500 years ago, what are you saying exactly?

Not saying anything.  Just posting what are most likely the drawings that were used to produce the model for anyone that finds this sort of stuff interesting.  These are the same books that many of our freight car models come from.

I don't remember these ever being posted before, only mentions of drawings, brochures and artwork.

FYI, the SW1000 is drawn similarly.

Jason


Philip H

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2014, 09:09:58 PM »
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The cab dimensions on the CC unit are pretty close to the cabs on ICGs rebuilt SW14's - the only difference being the ICG units didn't have windows in the center.
Philip H.
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"Yes there are somethings that are "off;" but hey, so what." ~ Wyatt

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u18b

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2014, 09:28:24 PM »
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I think it means that Con Cor did not make a "blunder" since they had sw1500 plans they were going by.

My guess is that the origination of the plans was an EMD pre-sales proposal for what an up-rated sw1200 would look like.

There are all kinds of plans like this.

I remember seeing the original proposal for the SD18.  It looked very little like the real SD18 when they came out.
Ron Bearden
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wazzou

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2014, 09:56:16 PM »
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My guess is that the origination of the plans was an EMD pre-sales proposal for what an up-rated sw1200 would look like.


I think this is pretty likely. 
The cab is kind of like a Spartan cab used on nearly all of EMD's second generation Road Switchers starting with the GP-35, I believe.
I'm guessing the thought was that a proposed Spartan cab or whatever EMD subsequently built the SW-1500 cab roof with could have been less expensive to fabricate.
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Sokramiketes

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2014, 09:59:39 PM »
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Good catch, Jason... I never put two and two together before.
Mike

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jmlaboda

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2014, 10:02:49 PM »
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Quote
I think it means that Con Cor did not make a "blunder" since they had sw1500 plans they were going by.

Well, hate to say it but right there is your first mistake.  The model, both cow and calf, were originally marketed by Atlas, made by Rivarossi.  After Atlas and RR parted company Concor picked up on the production of the model.

peteski

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2014, 11:47:27 PM »
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After Atlas and RR parted company Concor picked up on the production of the model.

Then Con-Cor contracted Sekisui/Kato to make a new mechanism for it.
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u18b

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2014, 11:50:59 PM »
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Well, hate to say it but right there is your first mistake.  The model, both cow and calf, were originally marketed by Atlas, made by Rivarossi.  After Atlas and RR parted company Concor picked up on the production of the model.

Yep.  Sorry.

Rivarossi must have consulted these plans.
Ron Bearden
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nkalanaga

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2014, 02:50:50 AM »
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I wouldn't be surprised.  Given the state of the N scale art in the 60s and early 70s Rivarossi generally did a good job on their shells, so it always seemed odd (to me) that they'd make such a mess of a simple switcher.
N Kalanaga
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randgust

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #11 on: August 29, 2014, 07:09:39 AM »
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Ah, it's not any worse than the old Athearn DD40.   That never existed either except in concept, and I'm pretty sure in a Railway Cyclopedia drawing - maybe even the same one.   We live in a different era now, when even locomotives that were built as demonstrators are not 'good enough' because they were modified by their first owners. 

I think it's good to point out that stuff.   I know today, for instance, that Kato looks for drawings from the manufacturers themselves - a 'third party' drawing such as published in MR isn't good enough.
« Last Edit: August 29, 2014, 08:53:02 AM by randgust »

spookshow

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #12 on: August 29, 2014, 08:49:40 AM »
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Thanks for pics, Jason. Excellent trivia for my encyclopedia page  :D

Cheers,
-Mark

daniel_leavitt2000

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #13 on: August 29, 2014, 12:07:35 PM »
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Was the original plan to use an uprated 567 engine? If I remember correctly, the only reason why the early SWs has the wide hood was because the 567 was much wider than the 645. I wonder why they chose to scratch the plan to use the angular cab. I'm sure the engineers designed it to have continuity with the rest of the line as I'm pretty sure they wouldn't be able to reuse any of the building jigs or tooling.
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JMaurer1

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Re: Close the book on the CC SW1500...
« Reply #14 on: August 29, 2014, 12:35:11 PM »
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I think that back in the day they wanted to come out with a new locomotive before anyone else could and about the same time the prototype was hitting the rails. Problem was that the original drawings were not anything close to the final plans for the locomotive. At that point, what do you do (well, if it was me, I would have fixed the model and just backdated the engine to something more appropriate). Not a problem anymore since not that many new (prototype) engines are coming out and manufacturers are waiting to make sure that it's a viable engine to model (used by multiple roads).
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